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 Replies: 40 / Views: 6,312 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3076 Posts |
I would have to agree with Shadow Re-Submit it....to ANACS or NGC
It won't be the first time I've of coins being body baged when you do know the true past, and that's not something they can tell in hand...
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1285 Posts |
If you have a graded coin, compare this coin next to it and slightly tilt the coin back and forth under some lighting. You may see subtle differences.
FWIW, I have a Morgan where the Obverse is in MS untouched but the reverse has been "very slightly" tampered with. Not sure what the heck they tried to do and why.
Peace.
Edited by Ceylon62
07/14/2010 08:25 am
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Valued Member
 United States
102 Posts |
Just out of curiosity here.
I know this coin hasn't been cleaned in 60 years. In fact, it hadn't been touched at all in 55 years before being cataloged a few years ago. What kinds of cleaning methods were in use over 60 years ago? Were coins being acetone dipped at that point?
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Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
Quote:
Were coins being acetone dipped at that point? Not really relevant - you can't tell a coin has been dipped in acetone unless it removes crud which leaves a surface which looks different than the area originally without the crud. If this coin was cleaned, it was chemical rather than mechanical. That practice has been going on for a hundred years. I don't see any obvious signs of mechanical cleaning. However, under your lighting, the cheek looks a bit shinier than it ought for a Mint State coin....I suspect they just refused to slab based on suspicion rather than actual evidence. When you get the coin back, look in the reeding. Sometimes people who dip coins using tongs do not account for the area where the tongs held the coin, and two spots on the reeds will remain toned even when the rest of the coin is clean. |
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Valued Member
United States
102 Posts |
Ah, interesting info, Dave. I'll take a close look when it gets home.
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Moderator
United States
15515 Posts |
Bummer about the .92 (again) New Mismatist. Your photos are excellent ..... and I see no evidence of a 'cleaning' ..... but like you am still learning all the details of this hobby. Similar to your Vancouver Half ...... why? Wish I had the sure for answer for you ...... but I don't. Best I can say is that TPG opinions of raw coins are subject to personal bias and an occasional bad day. I agree that this lovely Morgan should be cracked out and re-submitted to another TPG ...... shoot .... the next time PCGS itself might grade MS64. Keep us posted on what you decide and how it turns out ...... we are all pulling for you. David Take a look at my other hobby ... http://www.jk-dk.art |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
8904 Posts |
Quote:
92 - Cleaned  Boy, I didn't see that coming...  |
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Valued Member
United States
314 Posts |
Wow!! Great pictures. I only see just the one bag mark on her cheek and maybe a few small ones on the obverse and the reverse looks about the same. Hope it comes back at least MS65 for you. Should be a nice coin. Let us know.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2541 Posts |
I think you got robbed on that one.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1534 Posts |
Given that PCGS saw the coin in hand, I think they deserve the benefit of the doubt.
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Valued Member
United States
102 Posts |
I've never said that PCGS were wrong. As I said, I can't speak for what happened to this coin before it came into my family's possession 60-odd years ago. What I would like would be to gain a better understanding of exactly WHAT they're seeing on this coin that I cannot. I don't honestly care one way or the other whether or not this coin has actually been cleaned. But if it has been cleaned, I would like to know what signs there are present that indicate it. At least that way I'll be better equipped in the future to look for those things in both coins I own and coins I might purchase.
The grade is incidental. The knowledge is everything.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10982 Posts |
This is the first I've seen of this thread and winced a bit when I saw the pic.
The cheek/lower neck and obv. 7:00 field have a polished, or rubbed appearance. The details are certainly MS64 and this is a better date with only 750,000 minted, so PCGS might have been tough on it.
Estimated Mint State survival on this coin is only 41,000 pieces. It would be worthwhile for you to get an in-hand review from a local expert.
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Valued Member
United States
102 Posts |
Will do, bherring. There's a local dealer whose opinion I trust, and I'll get the coin in his hands soon.
Just out of curiosity, if what you see is a sign of cleaning, why would it be solely noticeable in only those areas and not more prevalent on the rest of the coin?
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10982 Posts |
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...why would it be solely noticeable in only those areas... I'm no expert and a really don't know. The reverse looks great. The obverse area from the nose to ear and downward looks "thumbed" or "rubbed". The luster and frost are disturbed. I bet that is what got the coin bagged. This is a high dollar piece that might make it into a problem-free holder eventually. Good Luck! |
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Valued Member
United States
102 Posts |
Thanks for the info, b. I'll resubmit and update the thread with results.
Cheers to all who've responded.
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Posted 07/14/2010 08:23 am
