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recoloring redcents

 
 
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Pillar of the Community

United States
958 Posts
 Posted 11/13/2010  11:33 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add coppertop5150 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Question , How do they do it and how does the grading company detect it ?

I have seen some on ebay that say " recolored ms-64 red "
or what not .

SO was this a ms-64 cent that was cleaned from dark brown to a light copper color then left set for a few months to cuase the red to comeback some.
New Member
United States
18 Posts
 Posted 11/14/2010  2:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add HAMILTON to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Coppers are some of finest and worst for collectors.This descibed item is like Marylyn Monroe with Malaria!Buyer Beware!Cleaning Is Cleaning,enough said.Rememeber reprocessed 1943's?Your item has been dipped.What they are using today?I don't know.The old dip(1960's-'70's)is no longer because of health hazard.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
17099 Posts
 Posted 11/14/2010  6:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Check out a similar post about the same subject here recently.
just carl
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United States
62543 Posts
Pillar of the Community
United States
3267 Posts
 Posted 11/16/2010  2:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add upstate to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Apparently no one really knows.
To bad we don't have a members who also is a professional grader;
that would be a great informative source.
Bedrock of the Community
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United States
12437 Posts
 Posted 11/16/2010  3:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
SO was this a ms-64 cent that was cleaned from dark brown to a light copper color then left set for a few months to cause the red to comeback some

Copper is typically recolored after it has been dipped n' stripped because no one wants ugly pink copper Most cleaned copper is left to retone naturally to a brown patina. Generally, you can tell if the patina has been messed with because natural brown and cleaned retoned brown almost never look the same. Natural patina should be fairly uniform, not spotty or streaky. Retoned patina may also have some color to it that would not develop naturally on circulated copper. These patination differences occur because stripped copper is very reactive and rapidly oxidizes.

Retoning can also be caused with the addition of darkening agents. One popular commercial product is known as "Deller's Darkener" and there are homemade recipes as well, many involving the use of sulfur.
These can be a bit trickier to detect and experience gained by looking at and holding as much copper as possible is your best defense. If you look at enough slabbed examples(or even unmolested raw coins) you will get a feel for what shades of brown should occur and what is the average natural appearance.

Retoning copper to Red is probably the most harmful form of copper coin doctoring simply because of the huge differences in value between Brown, Red-Brown, and Red. Once again, the experience of examining natural Red copper in hand is your best defense. Brown is more or less Brown but Red can range from a brassy yellow-orange to fiery deep red but pinks, bright oranges, or other day-glo colors are not normal. As far as retoning copper back to Red, I think that would be the most difficult type of retoning. More than likely, it would be done through chemical means.
Pillar of the Community
United States
3267 Posts
 Posted 11/16/2010  4:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add upstate to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Leave it to a biochemist
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