On The Silk Road The Cash Is Green- Turgesh Kagan

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Author	Replies: 9 / Views: 3,711
Ancientnoob Pillar of the Community United States 5155 Posts	Posted 11/15/2014 10:19 pm During the early middle ages the Arab advance into central seemed unstoppable and nearly complete, the products of the silk road lined the city streets and the pockets of merchants. The Sogd traders are among the most famous and celebrated trade cultures of the ancient world. Ancient Chinese and Indian texts make reference to large portions of the traders delivering wears on to Tang China were Sogd merchants. These people eventually became the word for merchant in the region. The Sodg clans resisted the Arab invasion and sought the comfort and support of the Chinese economic system. Casting coins in bronze with the Chief Tamgha and in Sogdiane script. (A type of Aramaic language.) What I don't understand is why the refernces say that the reverse tamgha is a Runic(?) letter "P". I thought Runic was being used in Europe and a "p" looks like modern "K."We need someone to go medieval on the subject and throw cash at it. Russian Turkestan Semirech'e, Sogd Turgesh Kaganate AE Fen 25 mm x 5.26 gram Cast AD 750-800 Obverse: Sogdian legend "Fen of King of Turgesh Kagan" around square hole Reverse: Tamgha of Turgesh in the shape of a runic letter "P" in the left field. Ref: Kamyshev's #24 in "Early Medieval Monetary Complex of Semirechie" Note: Extremely Rare. Thick beautiful green patina. Report this Post to the Staff

january1may Pillar of the Community Russian Federation 5186 Posts	Posted 11/15/2014 11:20 pm I suppose it refers to the so-called Turkic (Orkhon) runes, which would be from the same general area as this coin (though, IIRC, a bit later). No connection to the well-known Germanic runes other than looking vaguely similar. As far as I can tell, their letter for "p" looks kind of like the modern digit "1" (not that I can see this shape on the coin either). Report this Post to the Staff
Sap Moderator Australia 16982 Posts	Posted 11/15/2014 11:29 pm Quote: What I don't understand is why the refernces say that the reverse tamgha is a Runic(?) letter "P". I thought Runic was being used in Europe and a "p" looks like modern "K". They don't say it is a Runic P, they say it looks like a Runic P. I believe the letter peorth is the "Runic letter P" they are referring to. Which looks a little closer to the shape you see on the reverse of these Sogdian cash, but it's still not a match that would occur to me to say. Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis Report this Post to the Staff
Medieval Pillar of the Community 3772 Posts	Posted 11/16/2014 01:28 am 'Ancientnoob', did you do the attribution yourself or did you rely on the atribution given by a reliable dealer? The reason I am asking is that I found a site which shows several of those cash: http://www.sogdcoins.narod.ru/engli...e/coins.html and there they have as description for the reverse of Kamyshev#24: Tamgha of Turgeshs in the shape of stylized runic letter am. Which fits the image of your coin very well. There are other variants which have the Orkhon rune for 'P' ( 'january1may') on the reverse field as well. Postscript: Before I forget, congrats on the coin - hope I can find one myself. Edited by Medieval 11/16/2014 01:30 am Report this Post to the Staff
echizento Moderator United States 23731 Posts	Posted 11/16/2014 02:06 am Nate you found another interesting coin type, I have never seen this type before. Congrats Report this Post to the Staff
Ancientnoob Pillar of the Community United States 5155 Posts	Posted 11/16/2014 08:00 am Thanks guys. I am not seeing this runic letter either on my coin. Yes medieval I did attribute the coin myself. The seller provided only the mint and AE cash-like coin. I tried to confirm the attribution with a far more expensive coin of the same legend and similar weight being sold by Alex Fishman and it appaears that it might also be wrong. http://www.numismall.com/acc/Very-r...-w21151.html Report this Post to the Staff
Medieval Pillar of the Community 3772 Posts	Posted 11/16/2014 08:18 am You have Kamyshev on hand yourself? If yes, then there is some discrepancy for the reverse description of the type. In he link the description given for #24 matches your coin while your reverse description matches other varieties. Hope it all works out okay. Report this Post to the Staff
chrsmat71 Pillar of the Community United States 5008 Posts	Posted 11/16/2014 10:51 am fruit that! the prices in the link you gave are the sort of thing I was mentioning to you AN. I had actually been looking at some mauryan coins from that seller, and swung by the sogdians. thanks to some help from AN, I current have my sights on one of the type... Report this Post to the Staff
jcmworld Pillar of the Community United States 567 Posts	Posted 11/18/2014 11:41 pm Shall we play battle of the Central Asian cash coins? Let's start from the source. Here's a Tang Chinese issue from Kucha in Xinjiang: Tang, Dai Zong, Dali Period (766-79)Da Li yuan bao, reverse blank. H 14.130 Report this Post to the Staff
Ancientnoob Pillar of the Community United States 5155 Posts	Posted 11/19/2014 09:18 am JCM, Great piece and a contemporary to the original post. Cool. I am going to get me one of the early Tangs to go with my Yazdgard III drachm. Interesting to find out the Sassanian heirs fled there after the Arab subjugation of Persia. Report this Post to the Staff
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