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Tube Vs. Bellows

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 Posted 12/31/2011  05:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rmpsrpms to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sure, it might work well. It depends on how well the lens behaves when held vertically. Some of the latest zooms tend to not stay in place when vertical so won't hold their zoom setting. For your situation with 14-42mm, I'd suggest getting a Vivitar 2x Macro Teleconverter in Olympus mount. This will turn your 14-42 into a 28-84 Macro lens. No additional extensions needed to get bigger than 1:1 and it will naturally focus to infinity. Should be a sweet setup!
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Chute72's Avatar
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 Posted 01/04/2012  11:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chute72 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
http://www.ebay.com/itm/22092299253....m1423.l2649

Looking at bellows solutions. Computer on fritz, cannt communicate well.

Will this bellows mate directly to my 39mm EL-NIKKOR 105.
And can I mate the bellows to my Pentax K-x with a M39-PK adaptor?

Right, no good mid range bellows for pentax. Don't want cheap. Will pay more, but want to get something of better quality.

More later,
Thanks
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 Posted 01/04/2012  11:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rmpsrpms to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This bellows is not "native" Nikon. I think the Nikon mounts are removable and the underlying threads are either M42 or T-Mount (probably T-Mount). You will need to check out the mount threads before you can decide on what adapters you need. Bellows itself looks pretty nice...Ray
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 Posted 01/04/2012  11:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rmpsrpms to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here is a for-sure T-Mount bellows:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/25096574076....m1438.l2649

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Chute72's Avatar
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 Posted 01/05/2012  12:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chute72 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well,
I don't know what I'm doing, but I placed a bid.
I'm sure everything will be fine. If I get it, I'll add a few adaptors.
If I don't, I'll try again on the next one.
I've had such a terrible time with my computer, or more properly my server, that I just cannot communicate with anyone.
Thanks for your help. No thing will be bad. We are just working between good and better.
The real devil is the choices between better and best.
Funny, the older you are, the more you gain patience.
Thanks,
Kurt
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brg5658's Avatar
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 Posted 01/05/2012  12:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add brg5658 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Ray, I have a question too. I purchased this bellows on the BAY:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/19062190255....m1439.l2649

I also purchased a few adapters:

Canon 50D --> EOS-M42 --> Bellows --> M42-M39 --> Lens

Does sound reasonable? I'm so impatient waiting for this stuff!

Thanks,
-Brandon
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aladinslamp's Avatar
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 Posted 01/05/2012  01:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add aladinslamp to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Ok.......The thing is.....one can buy extention tubes...
But one forgets is the extention tubes work in there own particular environment,depending on the lenses MM size.. SUCH as RAY has explained..the thing is when you hook different lenses, say 35MM or 28MM and then...135MM lenses to the tubes....
lenses prevail to just what distant they will give you a good focal point....Extention tubes do work for some applications:
But I think your trying to concieve a general best option...
The bellows is the best option.... "Focal distance" of the lens to the sensor is the KEY......with the bellows one can put a 24MM lens to 135MM per say and adjust the lens to get the full coin shot or super up close Macro shot....DEPENDING ON THE CONS SIZE.......Obviously the 24MM will not get a great detailed shot of the silver dollar..
as it will of a CENT...This is why there are so many varieties of the MM scale.Know what your trying to capture
With the bellows you do have many focal points to capture....completely not extended... completletly extended
Its the lens MM 28 or so or the 135MM that determines the size your trying to capture, and each has its own focual point or DISTANCE FROM THE SENSOR Ray has been talking about...
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 Posted 01/05/2012  03:21 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rmpsrpms to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Brandon...that is one of my favorite bellows to work with. Nice quality, super precision. First thing when you get it...check to make sure none of the white plastic bearings are broken. If they are, they can be replaced but the bellows won't work well until they are. The adapters look correct for your camera and lens, so I think you are set as long as the bellows is in good shape when you get it...Ray
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 Posted 01/06/2012  08:05 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dougsmit to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Purists will point out that zooms don't make as good macro lenses as primes and, especially, those especially corrected for close work but you are correct that the zoom will allow more flexability in working with tubes. You will also find automatic diaphragm features retained by good tubes make life easier as well. The question is whether the lesser sharpness of the zoom presents a problem to you with the coins you shoot and the size images you need. Most of my coins are the limiting factor in detail rather than my camera equipment. I rarely want a coin image even as large as 12x18" (largest size I can get cheaply at Costco) and most of my prints are 4x6. The difference at that level is not seen like it is when you pixel peek the files on your computer.

Below is a 100% crop using a good zoom (Canon 70-200) and the whole coin from which it was taken. You could get sharper with a better camera and lens but the limiting factor is more likely the coin and the lighting. I recommend you use your existing equipment until you determine that the equipment is holding you back rather than something you are doing.
Tube-Vs.-Bellows
Tube-Vs.-Bellows

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 Posted 01/06/2012  09:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rmpsrpms to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
How did you get a whole coin shot using a 70-200 zoom? Even "macro focusing zoom" lenses won't go to that high a magnification. Unless that coin you're showing is like a foot across? What magnification was that shot taken at?

PS...I re-read your post, and assume you're using extension tubes? How far out did you push the lens for these shots and at what zoom level?
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Edited by rmpsrpms
01/06/2012 09:49 am
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 Posted 01/06/2012  11:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
EXIF data indicates the lens was at 126mm for that shot. It's not out of the question that one could put a full Morgan onto the sensor at that focal length, and this is a 22mm coin.

Given that the 70-200 has a minimum focusing distance of about 4ft, I have to wonder what effect extension tubes have on that statistic.
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 Posted 01/06/2012  12:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rmpsrpms to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thing that troubles me is how the EXIF data is being transmitted to the camera if extension tubes are used. Without tubes, you are not going to fill the screen with a Morgan dollar, let alone a 22mm coin. The rated magnification of the 70-200 at 1.2m is 1:4.8, so not useful as a macro lens by itself, hence my question about "how were these shots made?". Also, later 70-200's are "gelded", ie no manual adjustment of aperture, so it's going to take a very expensive and sophisticated set of extension tubes to transfer the electronics and the aperture functions from camera to lens...Ray
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 Posted 01/07/2012  01:06 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add aladinslamp to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
One thing I have noticed, is that one can combine,, The bellows with the Tuber idea........the first and foremnost understanding is...the bellows is fully adjustable..Not only within its scale or the knobs abillilty from fully closed to fully open,,, Distance for the coins objective........Full coin shot to macro shot...depending on the coins size which is a direct effect of what you what to shoot..Full Shots....or Macro.. Note....
I love the Bellows for this......The ability to adjust your focal range.....bellows fully collapsed for full coin shots to fully extended for macro shots..
Also ADD extenstion tubes to the front of the bellows
can yeaield great resultss...DEPENDING on the quality of your lenses...

The quality of your lenses IS foremost on the FINAL outcome.
.I Put My Cyclopse on this image, a full 15MB shot on the mintmark....No crops on this image.Or color ect..full shot
cut to post here...

Tube-Vs.-Bellows
]
I added a tuber to my bellows
My lens is a 100MM enlarginglens..so it should not get this magnification or quality found in smaller lenses fo9r the marcro field...

Cyclopse did a good jog...
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 Posted 01/07/2012  07:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rmpsrpms to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks pretty nice Gene. And I agree, that's high mag for a 100mm on bellows. Some bellows, like Nikon PB6, have extra extension bellows to get out to 300mm or more. You can do the same thing with extension tubes either on camera side or lens side (or both) of the bellows...Ray
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 Posted 01/07/2012  1:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Thing that troubles me is how the EXIF data is being transmitted to the camera if extension tubes are used.


Good point - it couldn't have been on an extension tube to transmit focal length. Given the nature of dougsmit's post, I think he was demonstrating the value of a good zoom lens as a counterpoint to bellows/tubes with primes.

Nice image, Gene. You're getting it.
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