Coin Community Family of Web Sites Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors
Shop for APMEX Bullion on eBay!Specializing in Modern Numismatics 300,000 items to help build your collection! Royal Canadian Mint products, Canadian, Polish, American, and world coins and banknotes. Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors Coin, Banknote and Medal Collectors's Online Mall Vancouvers #1 Coin and Paper Money Dealer








Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

Commems Collection Modern: US Commemorative Coin Surcharges

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 15 / Views: 3,878Next Topic  
CCF Master Historian of USA Commemoratives
Learn More...
commems's Avatar
United States
12253 Posts
 Posted 02/13/2014  5:40 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add commems to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I received an email a short time ago that asked if I would post some information about the surcharges associated with modern US commemorative coins. Surcharges have been in the news of late due to the reports regarding the Girl Scouts Centennial coin not meeting the minimum sales threshold to trigger the payment of the collected surcharges. So, I thought it might be of interest to others to read a brief summary of the general topic...

For each new coin it is directed to strike, the US Mint estimates its production costs (including the purchase of needed metals), its marketing costs and other associated administrative costs. It then forecasts the number of coins it expects to sell and determines a fully-loaded unit (per coin) break-even cost. From this unit cost is derived a per unit selling price that will (hopefully) ensure that the Mint's costs can be covered if the coin's actual sales meet (within a pre-determined margin of error) the forecasted target. On top of this unit cost is added a premium that is earmarked for the sponsor of the coin â€" this premium is referred to as a surcharge. US commemorative coins are and almost always have been a fund raising vehicle for their sponsors!

Over the years, the surcharges that have been added to each denomination of modern US commemorative coin have varied, but not greatly. Surcharges on the various half-dollars have ranged from $2.00 to $5.00, for silver dollars the range has been $7.00 to $10.00. For gold half-eagles, the surcharge has generally held at $35.00.

Surcharges have been a part of the modern US commemorative program since the very first issue in 1982 â€" the George Washington 250th Anniversary silver half-dollar. For this first issue, however, the collected surcharges did not go to a private sponsor; the surcharges were deposited into the US Treasury to help reduce the national debt.

The distribution of collected surcharges to sponsoring organizations began with the 1983-84 Los Angeles Olympics commemorative program. The Act authorizing the coins allowed for a surcharge of $10 per silver dollar and $50 per gold eagle. Collected surcharges were divided 50/50 between the United States Olympic Committee for training US Olympic athletes and the Los Angeles Olympic Organizing Committee to stage the Games. Sales of the coins generated over $65 million in surcharges; the two recipient organizations actually received more in surcharge royalties than their total covered expenditures. Excess monies were used to fund the United States Olympic Foundation.

Commems-Collection-Modern:-US-Commemorative-Coin-Surcharges Commems-Collection-Modern:-US-Commemorative-Coin-Surcharges

I've gone into some detail on the LA Olympics coin program because it is a good example of what can happen when a large number of coins are sold. In the case of the LA Olympic coins, roughly 4.47 million silver dollars were sold along with approximately 573,000 gold eagles. That volume level allowed the US Mint to make a profit on the coins it produced and enabled the sponsors to reap a strong financial benefit from the provided surcharges.

The model begins to break down, however, when coin sales fail to reach such lofty heights and/or the costs of producing and marketing the coins are higher than expected. Sales of commemorative coins during the period from 1986 through 1993 were sufficient enough for the US Mint to post a profit. But in 1994 and 1995, four different coins program resulted in losses for the US Mint. The Mint lost $4.1 million on the 1994 World Cup program, $100,000 on the 1994 US Capitol coins, over $300,000 on the 1995 Special Olympics coins and over $400,000 on the 1995 Civil War program.

A major concern regarding these financial losses was the fact that, despite the US Mint's loss, the sponsoring organizations of these coins were paid millions in surcharges. There wasn't a law in place at the time to ensure that US Mint production, marketing and other related expenses were covered before surcharge funds were distributed.

That all changed when Public Law 104-208 became effective in September 1996. The new law requires that the Mint must cover all of its costs associated with a coin program before any surcharges can be distributed. It also requires coin sponsors to raise funds from other private sources in an amount that is equal to or exceeds the surcharge amount they could receive to be eligible for the surcharges. This law continues in force to the present and is the reason why the Girl Scouts did not receive any surcharge funds â€" sales were not sufficient for the Mint to cover its costs for the program.

On its web site, the Mint indicates that modern commemorative coin sales have raised over $418 million in surcharges for coin sponsors and their objectives. Within that amount was more than $1 million that was raised by sales of the Black Patriots Memorial coins. It is one of the more unfortunate stories among the modern commemorative series. The US Mint paid the surcharges to the Black Revolutionary War Patriots Memorial organization, but the memorial was never built. Even worse, when the organization disbanded back in 2005, the surcharge money was missing.

A parallel can be found in the classic commemorative series when the 1936 Elgin, IL half-dollar is considered. Funds from the sale of that coin were to be used to erect Trygve Rovelstad's "Pioneer Memorial" statue in Elgin. The statue was never completed at the time, however, and the memorial project lacked adequate funds to have the artist's plaster version of the statue cast in bronze and erected until 2001; funds from sales of the 1936 coin played no part in the memorial's ultimate realization.

Commems-Collection-Modern:-US-Commemorative-Coin-Surcharges Commems-Collection-Modern:-US-Commemorative-Coin-Surcharges

About a year ago, a bill was introduced in Congress that aims to discontinue surcharges as part of US commemorative coins. If approved, private sponsors would no longer be eligible to receive surcharge funds and all profits made on the sale of the coins would be deposited in the US Treasury to help reduce the national deficit.

The bill hasn't gained much traction in Congress and appears unlikely to get approved. I'm disappointed in that as I would like to see a change in direction for our modern commemorative coins. I'd like to see an independent panel of highly-qualified US historians propose one or more annual commemorative coins and present their recommendations to Congress for review and potential approval. I'd like to see the special interest groups removed from the process and our coinage only be used to commemorate important people and defining moments/events in US history. Private organizations such as the Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, Lions Club and National Baseball Hall of Fame would no longer be eligible for coins. They could still petition Congress for a commemorative piece, but they would be limited to having a medal struck not a coin. Just my opinion, of course...

Hope all of that answers the original surcharge question I received. If not, let me know and I'll try again!
Collecting history one coin or medal at a time! (c) commems. All rights reserved.
Valued Member
United States
317 Posts
 Posted 02/13/2014  10:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add PennyPiggy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Someone correct me, but can't the mint order production of a minimum amount and order more as demand rises i.e. put the item on backorder until the product is available? Order a base number to start off and see where the actual numbers go. An over tally of 35000 coins on that Girl Scouts issue was awful.

I'm not a fan of the ‘96 CCRA because the mint has been pulling down over at least 200 MILLION dollars from at least 2001 so I don't buy the explanation the mint (who doesn't receive any tax payer support) can't afford to give the surcharges regardless of what one segment of the business does.

The mint just released their 2013 fiscal numbers and they had revenue of $4.34 BILLION with a net income of $292.5 MILLION. Say 100000 coins with surcharges of $10 equals 1 million times 2 programs equals roughly 2% of the entire revenue. They could easily pay that amount and not even blink.

The mint could get away with skipping the Girl Scout surcharges and there really hasn't been an outcry but I really couldn't imagine this being swept under the rug if the mint did a program like they did in say ‘86 and say "oops" we ordered too many coins and the Statue of Liberty isn't getting the surcharges, sorry folks. Heads would roll. They could quote this law or that law, a lot of people would be upset.

I'd like to see the surcharges go specifically to building/renovation projects to build the US infrastructure and/or rehab/tourist attractions and not go directly into the coffers of private organizations, anyway. But this really wouldn't be viable because very little could be done with the little amount collected by surcharges. An example is I remember reading that repairs at the Perry International Memorial in 2009 reached multiple millions of dollars. The surcharges would provide a start but wouldn't get the job done in most cases.

The Girl Scouts surcharge episode just highlights the mint still has problems concerning pricing/logistics of their commemorative coins and the '96 CCRA is just a cover up for the Mint's poor execution of product sales and poor management decisions. 35000 coin over tally? Unbelievable.
Pillar of the Community
Doug58s's Avatar
United States
899 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  06:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Doug58s to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Penny... I think your blaming the sales problems on the wrong people. The GSA design selection was based in a large part on the choice given by the GSA. That design wasn't well received by the coin collecting community. The same can be said of the current CRA coin. The GSA chose the coin to market - it is NOT on the mint to be the sales organization for these. I do believe the mint featured this coin on their website for most of 2013 and I received multiple flyers and emails - but that didn't make me like this coin. The GSA said produce this coin and we will sell it... and didn't.

If business practices have any play in this... the sales organization also is the one who usually places the order for the initial production numbers. If they sale those they order another production run... I've read elsewhere this initial run was probably based on the successful early sales of the BSA coin.

The mint gave some great design choices that were ignored - and produced by all accounts some high quality coins to sell. The GSA in turn did not sell these coins, and deserves nothing in return. (IMO)
Edited by Doug58s
02/14/2014 06:35 am
Rest in Peace
bpoc1's Avatar
United States
4078 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  06:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bpoc1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks Commems.
Pillar of the Community
Doug58s's Avatar
United States
899 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  06:55 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Doug58s to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'd also like to thank commems for his always - very readable posts! I appreciate the breakdown on the process for paying out surcharges and why the law denying them exists.
Moderator
Learn More...
jbuck's Avatar
United States
187702 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  10:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
A great read!

I did not realize that surcharge forfeiture was a recent concern for sponsors.


Quote:
I would like to see a change in direction for our modern commemorative coins. I'd like to see an independent panel of highly-qualified US historians propose one or more annual commemorative coins and present their recommendations to Congress for review and potential approval...
I like this idea. I think we have missed a lot of genuine opportunities in recent years.
CCF Master Historian of USA Commemoratives
Learn More...
commems's Avatar
United States
12253 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  12:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add commems to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@PennyPiggy: It's clear from your post here and in other related threads that you have a real issue with the way the Girl Scout coin was handled and with the US Mint in general. I respect your opinion, but can't agree with your viewpoint.

The act that redefined the surcharge rules represents a very financially sound practice. It applies to all commemorative coin issues and is not a secret. Every potential sponsor of a coin knows the rules going in, and every sponsor needs to abide by them. It's not left up to the Mint to decide who gets a surcharge distribution and who doesn't - it's defined by Congress with the President's approval! It would be illegal for the Mint to distribute surcharge funds to the GSA (or any other sponsor) even though they did not meet the minimum sales threshold.

The GSA silver dollar was not marketed/promoted well enough by its sponsor. The GSA organization musters their scouts each year to successfully sell millions of boxes of cookies. Maybe a bit more support of a similar nature for their coin in 2013 would have been enough to earn them their surcharges.


Collecting history one coin or medal at a time! (c) commems. All rights reserved.
Edited by commems
02/14/2014 12:31 pm
CCF Master Historian of USA Commemoratives
Learn More...
commems's Avatar
United States
12253 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  12:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add commems to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@jbuck/Doug58s/bpoc1: As always, thanks much for the kind words!


Collecting history one coin or medal at a time! (c) commems. All rights reserved.
Valued Member
United States
317 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  2:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add PennyPiggy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Ummm yeah ok, lol, you folks can discuss this one further if you wish, lol. It's a 3-day weekend, hope people enjoy Valentine's Day and if people are on the east coast, hope you're safe from all the snow.

Not really into the surcharge issue right now. Actually, I'm more interested into a US WWI commemorative for 2018 to celebrate a hundred years since the end of WWI.

Just thinking to what a surcharge should go to and the disregard and poor state of the WWI monument in Washington DC infuriates me a lot more than the Girl Scouts not getting the surcharge by far.

And no Commems, mean ole Penny doesn't have a bone with the US Mint who offers affordable products especially compared to other world mints and I really appreciate the hard working Americans supporting their families by working for the Mint, but I believe they goofed on that issue.

Thanks for starting the thread Commems, I disagree with you on this one but you're one of the few that bring out meaningful topics other than "I found this on ebay or in a store, what's it worth?" threads.

Thanks for the input Doug, I'll think about what you and Commems wrote and I might change my outlook on the situation going forward.

Enjoy the 3 day weekend and be safe people.
Pillar of the Community
kena's Avatar
United Kingdom
1682 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  3:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kena to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Commems many thanks for this post. You did a great job in answering my query.

Ken
Pillar of the Community
Doug58s's Avatar
United States
899 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  4:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Doug58s to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think comemms and jbuck point out the current downside to the commemorative process in general. The sponsor that has the most successful influence in DC gets a coin minted.

I'm not sure I'd go as far as to remove organizations from the process - since I think many are deserving. The March of Dimes coin is a great example of a coin that is going to be fine. I think the current HOF coins hold little actual merrit for being created...

I won't harp anymore on the GSA coin - but given they didn't market the coin enough to warrant a surcharge payout - it is frustating to think that another more worthwhile coin could have been minted and sold - and wasn't.

The vetting process for these needs to be better - the design choice needs to be much better - they can't keep going with these poor choices and expect collectors to just hand over $50 a coin... they need to draw buyers in as well as honor their organizations heritage. They have done just the opposite (IMO) and started pushing us away.

The fact that these didn't sell enough to warrant a surcharge payout, and the poor reception the CRA coin has gotten - it doesn't seem like anyone is actually listening to these issues.
Moderator
Learn More...
nickelsearcher's Avatar
United States
15389 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  6:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nickelsearcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This is likely the most informative and well-written post I have ever had the pleasure of reading in this sub-forum.

And that is saying a lot ... given commems propensity to offer informative and well-written posts.

I had no knowledge at all on the entire topic ... and now have a solid understanding of the legislation governing surcharges, the coin sponsor responsibility and potential future changes to the system ... all with one single post.

Commems ... you continue to amaze me with your encyclopedic knowledge and impeccable research ... exceeded only by your tremendous writing style which makes the information accessible ... and enjoyable ... to all.

Many Thanks

David
Take a look at my other hobby ... http://www.jk-dk.art
Bedrock of the Community
basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 02/15/2014  5:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I think the current HOF coins hold little actual merrit for being created...


Baseball has played a huge role in the past in American history. The HOF coin is basically just a baseball coin who contribution of society cannot be ignored. Jackie Robinson did more for race relations in the country as a whole as arguably anyone. Aside from fighting side by side in wars that was the first real thing that made the public reconsider segregation and changed a lot of peoples minds on it.

The Yankees playoff run in 2001 was huge for the city after 9-11, and the playoffs in general were a desperately needed return to some normalcy. Same goes for after major wars when the players got back as part of the healing and moving on process.

The boy scouts used to play a large role in society as well even though their influence is diminishing as kids would rather play video games and watch tv then go do scout things.

Theyve done a pretty good job selecting themes though its tragic there hasnt been a WWI coin by now. Its the designs that have been falling sort though.

I agree with you though the Girl Scouts have no one to blame but themselves. Anyone could have looked at that coin and seen it would be a hard sell. It wouldnt have been hard for them to sell them along with their cookies or at least pass out flyers about it with the cookies to try and promote sales.
Pillar of the Community
Doug58s's Avatar
United States
899 Posts
 Posted 02/15/2014  6:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Doug58s to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Baseball has played a huge role in the past in American history.


While all that is true - they are celebrating the HOF - of a multi-billion dollar organization, and tacking on surcharges from the coin collecting community. I believe if baseball wants to continue the HOF - then perhaps they should step up and fund it. Or even some of the retired millionaires should help fund it. It has gotten to the point that this isn't about creating collectible coins with a benefit - but about doing a charity drive.

Hence my stating it has little merit - being commemorated.
Bedrock of the Community
basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 02/15/2014  6:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I believe if baseball wants to continue the HOF - then perhaps they should step up and fund it.


They do fund it. It was just a way to get another baseball coin. Theres nothing about that design that says HOF and not just the sport itself.
Pillar of the Community
United States
5197 Posts
 Posted 02/15/2014  9:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jack jeckel to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The sponsor that has the most successful influence in DC gets a coin minted.


Not to knock the original post or topic of surcharges are government pandering but last year we had a presentation at our club meeting from the head of the inhouse design department for the public transportation bus passes for Milwaukee, WI.

He mentioned that many groups contact them to get their group or agenda on the weekly bus pass (52 per year)

He said that when they chose the weekly theme the suggesting or sponsoring organization has 0% input on the design.

I hope the mint goes the same route and goes back to some more historical 3D commemorative designs (such as the Texas and Oregon Trail which is why I bought those 2) instead of the "flat" 2D modern designs.

I think now is the resurgence in collecting before it falls off in 2 or 3 years of the designs and themes continue to disappoint the current collector market.

The curved baseball half may help a little.
  Previous TopicReplies: 15 / Views: 3,878Next Topic  

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



    




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.59 seconds to rattle this change. Forums