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 Replies: 14 / Views: 1,482 |
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New Member
Australia
4 Posts |
Hi
I am a new member who knows nothing about coins. A friend recently showed me two coins. They were slightly larger in diameter than a penny, coppery not silver in colour, extremely worn, had CAROLUS around the outside, other illegible writing and the date 1833. Each had an incomplete circular stamp on it about 1/2 inch in diameter with the number 44 or 47 on it. One coin had the stamp more of less central in it and the other had it offset as though the stamp had moved. The perimeter edges of the coins have a kind of double ridge so that if you rolled them along they would leave two lines about 1/16 inch apart. Can anyone point me to an identification of these coins.
Faithfully John.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7123 Posts |
Hi John
Welcome to the forum !!!
Im afraid that I cant help with the coin !! but I can ask a couple of questions?
from your description, I cant tell if we received a description of both sides of the coin or just one, if it is one please seperate the description by sides, it will help when looking for answers.
any Idea where your friend may have come across the coins ?
Rick
Edited by Metalman
07/15/2005 2:32 pm
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New Member
United States
8 Posts |
There isn’t much to go on, but here’s an opinion. The ruler of Spain from 1833 to 1840 was Carlos IV (the pretender) so your coins could be copper ¼ Reales or possibly 2 Maravedis depending upon where they were Minted, in Spain or one of their possessions. Spain’s possessions at that time included: Mexico (eight mints), Guatemala, Peru, Philippines, Columbia, Bolivia and Chile. Without an image to view it is a bit difficult to narrow down any further. Assuming it’s a valid coin and period stamp, the circular stamp on the coins might be a counter mark. Several countries used counter marks to make the coinage of other nations usable in their country or by the issuing country to devalue coinage. Maybe this will help a little. JDW
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Forum Mom
 United States
5877 Posts |
Hi John and welcome to the forum! Do you have any way of posting pictures or scans of the coins? That would make identification much easier.  |
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New Member
 Australia
4 Posts |
I now have some photos of the coins in question. How do I post them to this forum?
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Forum Mom
United States
5877 Posts |
Here are some pics that John forwarded to me. I have never seen a coin like this one, but hopefully someone here has.   |
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Forum Mom
United States
5877 Posts |
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Valued Member
Netherlands
309 Posts |
Hello John, Susan,
The first coins is a 40 Reis piece from Brazil, Krause number 363.1, Mintmark R, weight 14.34g. 1830, mintage unknown.
The second coin shown is a 20 Reis, Krauze number 474 1869, from this year farieties are known.
Greetings, Carl
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Valued Member
United States
254 Posts |
Very nice coins- I like them! ~neuron |
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New Member
Australia
4 Posts |
Thanks Susan and Carl
My friend has a second coin similiar to the 40 Reis one pictured however the 40 stamp is crooked and offset to the 7 o'clock position.
Petrus I (Don Pedro) was the first "Emperor" of Brazil following its independence from Portugal in 1822. He was forced to abdicate early on and was replaced by his five year old son, Petrus II. The latter ruled well over many years.
Are these coins worth anything? My friend has many other old coins that I will endeavour to post in due course.
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Valued Member
Netherlands
309 Posts |
Well, if your frend got some scans/foto's from those coins, identification is no problem at all, just send them up, and I will help you out. Greetings, Carl  |
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Rest in Peace
United States
954 Posts |
Just had to say. Even after 50 years as a coin collector I am still seeing coins I have never come across or knew anything about. Nice pieces. Thanks for sharing and thanks to everyone who help I.D. them. catman |
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New Member
Australia
4 Posts |
Thanks everyone for the kind words about these coins and especially to Carl who provided the identification. I am a completely ignorant in these things. Is it etiquette to request a valuation on this forum and could Carl please explain a little more about the Krause Number...is it some sort of coin catalogue? These coins must be close to the first ones ever minted in the independent Brazil. I will try to photo more coins over the weekend for you. I could easily get hooked on this stuff. Regards John.
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Forum Mom
United States
5877 Posts |
Carl, when I looked in Krause to give values for these, I saw that KM#363.1 was for the 20 on 40 Reis. I am not familiar enough with Brazilian coinage to be sure, but I think the mint mark could also be a "B", which would make it KM#444.2.
If I am correct, The values given in Krause for the 40 Reis are:
2.50 (Good); 5.00 (VG); 7.50 (Fine); and 12.50 (VF). I think yours is Good.
The 20 Reis values in Krause are:
1.50 (Fine); 2.25 (VF); 4.00 (XF); 7.00 (Unc). I think yours is XF.
Most of us use the Krause Catalog of World Coins to identify non-US coins, though there are other good references that I have found for UK and Canadian coins. The Krause books are a 4-volume set with each book being about the size of a telephone book. It has been my experience that the values given in these books are not accurate (usually coins sell for lower), but they are wonderful for identification. The volumes are 1601-1700, 1701-1800, 1801-1900, and 1901-Present. They tend to run $45-$65 per volume.
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Valued Member
Netherlands
309 Posts |
Hello Again Susan, John, By "blowing up" the picture, you can look well at the mintmark Susan, therefore you can see the difference, and to "re"check it, I looked in my own collection, I have both types myself, the B mintm. goes nice round, the R has on it's first leg a twist to the left, like you see on the posted pick. The Krause catalog is the most used catalog for the most collectors who collect foreighn coins I think, it's a pitty that that catalog coast here over 65 euro each, so most collectors use them for a little longer then a year  Those who swap/trade coins by the internet, use most of the time the krause prices to compare their trade for equal faleu, so it's a handy book, maybee some day it can get on CD, instead in a bookform that weights more then my working boots!!  Greetings, Carl |
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Replies: 14 / Views: 1,482 |
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Posted 07/15/2005 2:28 pm
