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Please Help! Very Mysterious Oriental Coin / Token!

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New Member

United Kingdom
7 Posts
 Posted 01/02/2016  4:35 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add GMFirst to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hello all. I originally posted this in coins/tokens, but was recommended to re-post it here.

I've recently acquired (bought from ebay) a very strange Japanese/Chinese coin.

I design board games and I have been working on a feudal-Japan-conquer-and-control - style game. I really needed something to be a very cool "first player" marker, so I thought I would get an antique coin - something tangible that people could pass around and would really appreciate.

So... I searched and found a very exciting-looking coin on ebay. Bought it. Coin arrived. All good.

The coin is about 2 inches wide, bronze colour, looks old but not ancient. (See pictures).

Well... the problems soon started. I tried to identify the writing on the back - the seller didn't know, friends didn't know (although they thought that it was probably a Chinese coin - not much help for a Japanese game). Tried facebook for any help - nothing, other than "probably a Chinese coin".

Right. Getting very vexed now. I go down to my local two Chinese takeaways and try asking very politely for them to help me translate. The first one (very busy - not interested) dismissed it as an "old Chinese coin". Great. The second one (very friendly) was happy to take a look, quickly said that it was Chinese, but then got very anxious and asked, "Are you Christian?" I said yes, thoroughly confused, though I know that she is quite a keen practising Christian. She then said that I shouldn't have this if I am Christian - that it is something like a curse - definitely not a coin. She said that she couldn''t actually translate it but actually encouraged me to throw it away!

Thoroughly confused and a little anxious (as we have always got on well and I didn't want to worry her), I tried an image recognition/translation software - nothing. Then I remembered seeing this community when I tried to identify the coin the first time and thought that you could help.

Well? Any thoughts? I would love to be able to go back to her and explain the real translation, plus I need to know what I've got if I'm going to be handing it around in a board game or for friends to take a look at!

So far, I've had a very kind comment on the original post from member "Harmonica" who had some good suggestions - probably Chinese, possibly a re-print of a cash coin, but no-one seems to know or be able to translate the multitude of characters on the back. The front (4 symbols) may be (according to a Chinese friend's mother) a protective blessing / proverb / aphorism - something to do with getting through hardships.

The mystery deepens!

Do you think that you could help?



Please-Help!--Very-Mysterious-Oriental-Coin-/-Token!

Please-Help!--Very-Mysterious-Oriental-Coin-/-Token!
Edited by GMFirst
01/02/2016 4:36 pm
Pillar of the Community
Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 01/03/2016  04:06 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You more or less have it. For the Chinese, the cash coin has held a certain significance/superstition for a couple thousand years. In addition to the actual money issued by the Chinese government, there are literally thousands of non-money "cash" designs, usually promising good luck or fortune.

We have a few members on here who are proficient in Chinese. Hopefully one of them will pop in to translate your coin.

Sadly, your coin is very modern. Genuine cast cash coins have a rough field beneath the raised characters. Modern "cash" reproductions or fantasies wi frequently incorporate small bumps to simulate this effect. Your coin has these, which means it is probably just a few years old.

Whether this is something of actual cultural significance, or just tourist junk remains to be seen!
Pillar of the Community
Petrus's Avatar
Belgium
2895 Posts
 Posted 01/03/2016  09:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petrus to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It looks like a Daost charm.
But it is a modern tourist replica.
The background is typical for replica's.
Yours has a square hole.
Looks like these:
http://primaltrek.com/daoist.html
Perhaps you van send your pictures to that site for more information.
New Member
United Kingdom
7 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2016  07:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add GMFirst to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Mystery solved!
Examples of Daoist Charms



Old Daoist charm with "magic
writing" inscriptionThis is a very large and nicely cast specimen of an old Daoist charm. The central hole is round as opposed to square.

The large characters at the extreme right and extreme left are not Chinese but rather Daoist "magic writing". While Daoist priests would like for the meaning to be kept a secret, these particular magic writing characters can now be understood.

Regarding the very large character on the left, the upper half is "magic writing" for the Chinese character lei (#38647;) which means "thunder" and refers to the "God of Thunder". The lower part is "magic writing" for the Chinese character ling (#20196;) which means "to order".

The top portion of the very large character on the right, consisting of what looks like a three prong fork with three small circles underneath, is the magic writing equivalent to sha (#26432;) which means "to kill". The part of the character below the three small circles is the Chinese character gui (#39740;) which means "ghost" or "spirit".

The inscription of the two magic writing characters, read left to right, can thus be translated as the "God of Thunder orders the demons to be killed".

Each line of the Chinese inscription on the charm is written vertically top to bottom and right to left. For your convenience, the inscription is written below in the more conventional method with each line read from left to right:

#38647;#36208;#26432;#39740;#38477;#31934; (lei zou sha gui jiang jing)
#26025;#22934;#20986;#37034;#27704;#20445; (zhan yao chu xie yong bao)
#31070;#24773; #22857; (shen qing feng)
#22826;#19978;#32769;#21531;#24613;#27762;#20043;#20196; (tai shang lao jun ji ji zhi ling)

The Chinese character inscription can be translated as follows:
"God of Thunder (Lei) clear out and kill the ghosts and send down purity.
Behead the demons, expel the evil and keep us eternally safe.
Let this command from Lao Zi (Tai Shang Lao Jun1)
Be executed quickly."

1 The title Tai Shang Lao Jun (#22826; #19978;#32769;#21531;) was bestowed upon Lao Zi (#32769;#23376;) by imperial command in 1013 AD.
New Member
United Kingdom
7 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2016  07:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add GMFirst to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


Please-Help!--Very-Mysterious-Oriental-Coin-/-Token!
Valued Member
packrat1's Avatar
United States
185 Posts
 Posted 01/07/2016  5:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add packrat1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Did you ever find a coin for your game? Are you wanting an actual coin or a coin to mold or copy from?
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