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Are NCLT Coins Really Legal Tender?

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MobOfRoos's Avatar
Australia
762 Posts
 Posted 02/27/2016  8:05 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add MobOfRoos to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
This story is from the UK but it has relevance to Australian NCLT collectors.


Quote:
The Royal Mint is suffering a backlash after it sent a memo to banks telling them not to accept high-value 'legal tender' commemorative coins over the counter.

Buyers have flocked to the special edition coins in recent years, with many believing they would always be worth their face value, but This is Money readers have hit out as banks have now been told to stop cashing them in.

At the weekend, we revealed on how one reader was left with £29,300 worth of commemorative coins after HSBC, which had accepted them in the past, suddenly refused them.

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/...-buyers.html



Apparently these coins were being sold at face value and people were buying them up to get rewards points on their credit cards before taking the coins down to the Bank to cash them in.

I haven't heard of that happening here yet but it does beg the question that if the coins arn't legal tender and arn't worth face value then they arn't really coins.
Valued Member
United States
265 Posts
 Posted 02/27/2016  8:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Brushy Bandit to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Gotta admit the credit card points hustle, sounds pretty sweet.
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Jeff's Avatar
Australia
877 Posts
 Posted 08/24/2016  5:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jeff to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Australian NCLT coins are legal tender and banks will cash them in at face value. Every Australian coin, except holey dollar and dump (which have been demonetised)is legal tender.
That means banks should also cash in pre-decimal but you might find a reluctance there if you tried it.
They certainly do cash in 1¢, 2¢ and 1966 round 50¢. I have often been able to obtain those from banks -paper notes too- saves them the trouble of packing them to return (minimum quantities apply for that).

The rewards points scam would not apply in Australia because NCLT issues are sold at a premium to face value.

Edit P.S. I have also occasionally been able to get $200 gold coins this way too. They are worth around double face value.
Many bank tellers now know the value of some of these coins and will buy them for themselves.
Edited by Jeff
08/24/2016 5:45 pm
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BStrauss3's Avatar
United States
4593 Posts
 Posted 08/24/2016  5:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BStrauss3 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Of course they are. They say right on the mint site. You just can't use them to buy anything.

A lawyer by the name of Lincoln once asked "How many legs does a dog have if you call the tail a leg"?

The answer is 4, just because you call it a leg doesn't make it one.
-----Burton
50+ year / Life / Emeritus ANA member (joined 12/1/1973)
Life member: Numismatics International, CONECA
Member: TNA, FtWCC, NETCC, EveryCountry (online) coin club
Owned by three cats and a wife of 40+ years (joined 1983)

Author: 3rd Edition of the Sample Slabs book, https://www.sampleslabs.info/
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Sap's Avatar
Australia
16850 Posts
 Posted 08/24/2016  6:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The core problem is the "buy $20 for $20 in bulk, we'll even throw in free shipping, you can pay by credit card" attitude some modern mints have adopted. This leaves them open to credit card points-skimmers. While I have little empathy for the scammers, I hold the Mint ultimately to blame. They should never have combined those three things. Either "buy $20 for $25 each", make them pay for shipping, or refuse credit card transactions. Any one of those would break the cycle and ensure that only coin collectors and speculator-investors buy the coins.

As for "legal tender", that's defined by law in the country of issue. These British coins are still "legal tender" in Britain, in terms of: you can still pay your taxes with them, and you can still use them to offer as payment for a debt. So if the bank charges you a fee or calls in a debt you owe to them (such as a loan repayment or credit card installment), you can pay the amount owed in these coins, and the bank would be obliged to accept them, as they have been tendered in payment of a debt.

Further, the memo sent by the Mint to the banks was completely out of order. It is, frankly, none of the Mint's business what people choose to do with their coins once they are issued and sold. It is the Mint's stupid marketing decision that created the problem (as outlined in the first paragraph), they should bear the cost of solving their problem. And sack their marketing department, if they're looking for a scapegoat to blame.

From the Australian perspective, very few NCLT coins are or were issued for face value. The early $5 coins such as 1988 come to mind. There were also some near-face-value precious metal coins that became de-facto face-value NCLT when the price of PMs collapsed back in the 80s and 90s. The silver 1982 $10 and gold koala $200 coins come to mind.

In all cases, the banks in Australia happily accepted them as deposits and returned them to the Mint, though some, perhaps being stung by counterfeit NCLT being deposited, put policies in place not crediting your account until after the Mint had verified that the coins were genuine. There weren't enough people depositing NCLT for the Mint to consider it a major problem. The RAM and Perth Mints would be very, very foolish to attempt to imitate the RCM and Royal Mint in this regard.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Sap's Avatar
Australia
16850 Posts
 Posted 08/24/2016  6:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just double-checked, to make sure I remembered correctly. British £20, £50 and £100 coins are legal tender for payments "of any amount". It says so, right on the Royal Mint's FAQ page for the definition of Legal Tender. So, the bloke with the £29,300 credit card debt he presumably now needs to repay? No worries, he can pay the entire debt using his stockpile of silver coins.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Barefoot's Avatar
Australia
15 Posts
 Posted 09/01/2016  09:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Barefoot to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I had one date with a guy who used $5 coins to pay for the date. I was flabbergasted and needless to say we only had one date. He was truly an idiot.
(I was a broke teen, otherwise I would have bought them off him.)
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