Unknown Polish? Coin For ID - Not Mine

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.

Author	Replies: 3 / Views: 1,432
january1may Pillar of the Community Russian Federation 5172 Posts	Posted 03/27/2021 11:21 am I've seen this coin posted for ID in an online chat I'm a member of. I checked all over the place on Numista and was unable to find anything that would match. So, with permission of other members of the chat, I'm posting it on CCF. (I'm not aware of any rules against this; if there are any, I apologize.) I wonder if the pictures are even the right way up... 20.5 mm, no weight mentioned. The original poster assumed it was a Polish trojak; this looks plausible at first glance, but the legend doesn't match. I'm posting it here (instead of the Ancients forum) because of the obvious 6 at 11 hours on the reverse, which is in the right place to be the 6 of an 16xx date. It could in principle also be a 9 in 159x or (less likely) 1xx9, in which case this coin would not belong here, but this would require the reverse to be upside down, which I doubt (for now). I suppose in theory could also be the 6 of 156x with 15 omitted. Assuming that the reverse is the right way up, here's my best guess at the legend: [1?]6. xxx [O?R?]N xx RxD [P?]OL xxx DAx xxxx [R?]O[V?]NI xxx [I?]xNO[V?] [x?]DR[A?x?]OPD .P[E?]V[x?O?] Note that this is utterly unlike the legend of any actual trojak I could find (in particular, there's nowhere to fit TRIPLEX), and I could find nothing with a DR in the second-last line like that). On the obverse I can read NGRV[I?]O at 7-10h, which again does not match any trojak type I could find. There's another O at 2h that seems to be the second letter of a name (such as Johann or Joseph), but little else is visible in that area. Any ideas for ID? I'm honestly running out of any, and starting to suspect a contemporary counterfeit (though if so it looks fairly well executed for one). Report this Post to the Staff

tdziemia Pillar of the Community United States 7934 Posts	Posted 03/27/2021 4:11 pm The other character who looks a lot like Sigismund III and issued trojaks is his cousin, Gustavus Adolphus, who issued some during the Swedish occupation of Elbing in 1631-1633. These would have the 16 digits in the right place reverse, but I don't see a good match on the reverse legends (either GROS ARGE / TRIP CIVIT / ELBINGEN, or GROS ARG / TRIP REG / SVEC) unless there is a double strike / overstrike on this coin. I think trojaks were issued in Transylvania, parts of Silesia, and other places with similar design. Though the six-line legend reverse I don't recall. Edit: Add Courland to that list, Prussia, maybe other German states? Though the figure obverse is not wearing a crown in most of these. The impression you made of the reverse looks like the Riga city gate in the upper central part of the coin, splitting the legend. But I couldn't find anything for Swedish Livonia Edited by tdziemia 03/27/2021 4:41 pm Report this Post to the Staff
january1may Pillar of the Community Russian Federation 5172 Posts	Posted 03/27/2021 4:47 pm Quote: Edit: Add Courland to that list, Prussia, maybe other German states? And Ragusa, which I would never have guessed. But that's not a match either. I couldn't figure out enough to split the difference between "a type from a minor para-Polish state too obscure to show up on Numista" and "a contemporary counterfeit and the legend is gibberish". And I hadn't realized it could also be a multiple strike. On most trojaks I've seen, the arms and the date are on the bottom of the legend, which is why I suspected that the reverse might be upside down. But there isn't really any letter that would look like an upside-down R. Quote: The impression you made of the reverse Not mine; none of the pics are (though I've downsized them for CCF). It does look like there's something in the middle of the top 2-3 lines that isn't legend, but I can't figure out what it might be.. Incidentally, if it helps for looking in a right direction, the original poster was from Serbia. Report this Post to the Staff
tdziemia Pillar of the Community United States 7934 Posts	Posted 03/27/2021 5:32 pm Quote: And Ragusa . But that sure isn't a bishop's mitre Polish trojaks with the "16" up on that part of the reverse were strongly debased from 81% silver in 1616 to 45% by the time the last were issued in 1624. But I've never seen one that dark in color. We know that counterfeits of billon Livonian solidi of the 1640s were coming out of southeast Europe looking browner than the originals. You and other chat board members know more than I do about other types being counterfeited back then, but that sounds like the most plausible explanation. Edited by tdziemia 03/27/2021 5:35 pm Report this Post to the Staff
	Replies: 3 / Views: 1,432

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.

All Forums Category: World Coins and Currency Forums Forum: World Coins and Commemoratives

Silver Gold Bull US is the United States leading bullion dealer. We deliver gold coins, gold bars, silver coins, silver bars and precious metals to your door. Order today!

The First Dollar, your premier source for bullion and rare coins. See our bullion list on the site and the coin inventory on ebay.

View Last 100 New Topics

View Last 100 Active Topics

Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us | Advertise Here | Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum

It took 0.27 seconds to rattle this change.