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Celtic Coinage - Stater - Any Input Would Be Helpful

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Valued Member

United States
82 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2011  11:39 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add christopher walton to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hello all,

First time in this area and I hope this is an appropriate category for this one.

Yet another area I am not up with and information, opinions or anything would help.

The coin label has: "Stater. c. 125-100 BC" "Celtic Coinage. Period of Belgic Migration" "Seaby #1"



Celtic-Coinage---Stater---Any-Input-Would-Be-Helpful



Celtic-Coinage---Stater---Any-Input-Would-Be-Helpful
Valued Member
palaniappan's Avatar
India
265 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2011  6:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add palaniappan to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
very nice coin

warm wishes

chance favors the prepared mind.

Valued Member
United States
82 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2011  9:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add christopher walton to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you, palaniappan.

I ran it by a rather established coin/jeweler/gold dealer today who verifed that it was gold and indicated it was rather unusual/rare but couldn't/wouldn't offer much more. I do hope someone wanders along who knows something about them. The Spink's book thinks rather highly of them, at least according to their pricing.
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bobbyhelmet's Avatar
United Kingdom
2838 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2011  09:03 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobbyhelmet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Beautiful coin, more than a bit jealous

Its from Northern Gaul and made by the Ambiani.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ambiani.

Date could be slighty wider than Seaby indicates, 150-50BC.

On the obverse is the head of Apollo, left with elaborate hairstyle in a Celtic design derived from the earlier Apollo prototype on the Macedonian staters of Philip II.

The reverse is a stylised horse, left with disjointed driver guiding a chariot, rosette below and other patterns in fields. Cant really see it on yours but there should also be a single chariot wheel behind (to the right) of the horse.

The Kingston museum has some of these from the Chessington hoard and so does the British museum.
http://www.kingston.gov.uk/browse/l...on_hoard.htm
http://www.heritage-images.com/Prev...censeType=RM

What does it weigh? and how big is it?

I think it is one you may need to get authenticated by an expert - if real they can sell for between �£1-4000.

As with all valuble and rare coins many reproductions and fakes are available.
http://www.dorchesters.com/coins/re...ic_coins.htm

Yours seems to have had 'B' stamped on it twice on the obverse - I dont know if this is something you should be worried about.

Edited by bobbyhelmet
02/25/2011 09:08 am
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bobbyhelmet's Avatar
United Kingdom
2838 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2011  09:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobbyhelmet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
http://www.acsearch.info/search.htm...iew_mode=1#3

Some sale prices here - the larger ones (7.25g) being worth much more than the smaller (1.8g) ones.
Valued Member
United States
82 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2011  11:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add christopher walton to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
bobbyhelmet - Thank you very much for your input!

The size is 20.5mm - 22mm - it isn't perfectly round, of course. As for the weight, I've not had the occasion to have to precisely weigh coins in the past, so I don't have anything to do it right, but the less-than-precise scale I do have says 6gm. As far as the authentication, I have a call in to Freeman and Sear. Mr. Freeman is out-of-town until next week, but I've been told he will get back to me when he returns.

Even though my dad did due dilligence with all his collections, I am well aware that fakes get past even the most careful collectors and, considering the possible rarity and value, I am taking the necessary, serious steps that I can to verify the piece. Your advice is welcome and reassuring that I'm working in the right direction. Thank you, again.
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bobbyhelmet's Avatar
United Kingdom
2838 Posts
 Posted 02/26/2011  08:12 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobbyhelmet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Good stuff - yours is on the larger size then.

Keep us informed and hopefully the news from Freeman is good.
Valued Member
United States
82 Posts
 Posted 02/26/2011  1:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add christopher walton to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
bobbyhelmet - Yes, I will post what Mr. Freeman has to say about the piece - then I'll have to find the time to get to the rest of the 35 or so coins dating up to 423BC. I, too, hope things go well as I may need to use his assistance a lot.
Valued Member
United States
82 Posts
 Posted 03/02/2011  8:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add christopher walton to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
bobbyhelmet - I met with Mr. Freeman today and we spoke for about an hour and a half. It looks like it may be the first of many visits. There is good news and bad news about the stater - the good news: it is real, has a weight of 7.29gm and dates to 2nd C. BC. The bad news is that it is only in good to very good condition as there are a couple of scratches and wear of the high points, but the face is very nice and 'pleasing'. Mr. Freeman is a very pleasent, easy-going fellow and quite east to speak with.



Edited by christopher walton
03/02/2011 9:49 pm
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bobbyhelmet's Avatar
United Kingdom
2838 Posts
 Posted 03/02/2011  11:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobbyhelmet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Excellent news Chris!

Glad its been authenticated, all to often when coins of this rarity and value appear they turn out to be reproductions or fakes, its nice to have a happy ending.

Good news too for the other 35 from your fathers collection (must admit I'm looking forward to seeing more of those ) as if this one is real then it probably means the others are all good too.

Wear or not its a very attractive and interesting coin.

If your stuck with any of the others please do post them, even if its just for opinions. I'm by no means an expert with Celtic and Greek coins (I know a bit about Roman coins but thats about it!) but we do have a few experts on the forum.
Valued Member
United States
82 Posts
 Posted 03/03/2011  10:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add christopher walton to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes, it was a relief to find out that the stater is real. He did say that the value was probably 1/4 of the entire book (perhaps 150 coins total). I took the book with the 'British' coins along and he browsed through. Of the 35 or so other 'Celtic' coins, he pulled one and said it was a copy/fake, but the others passed muster. He seemed somewhat interested by the later British tokens but, as this was a courtesy call so to speak, I didn't get appraisals on them. Therefore, I guess you will get to see some of the others, too. This forum seems the best place I've found for educated opinions and critiques.
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richtea's Avatar
United Kingdom
25 Posts
 Posted 09/17/2018  2:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add richtea to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Never too late to comment, eh? :-)

> The coin label has: "Stater. c. 125-100 BC" "Celtic Coinage. Period of Belgic Migration" "Seaby #1"

It's an S2, rather than an S1. On S1 the bust faces right.
From John Sills' excellent book (https://www.vcoins.com/en/stores/ch...fault.aspx), it's:
- Gallo-Belgic Ab1 Class 7, i.e. the last ones to be made of that large stater.

He has a mere 27 of them listed (at the time of writing in 2003), but that may have gone up a little more with recent detecting finds.
The condition isn't at all bad. These early starters are often quite worn. I guess usage plus high gold content causes that.

Fabulous coin, and only just spotted it - had to post. Jealous!
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