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 Replies: 20 / Views: 3,076 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
648 Posts |
The only thing that's bankrupt is America.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2189 Posts |
No, Your tin foil hat is not on two tight.I'm in agreement on a few points you have about privacy when buying gold or silver for my personal hobby for obvious security reasons.I do not broadcast to the world my purchases or what I sell
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Valued Member
United States
223 Posts |
All of my toys are bought with cash. Silver, guns, knives and 4-wheelers. I don't believe in credit and won't pay interest on what are essentially luxury items.
On the issue of profits for income tax purposes, if you are paying in cash how is anyone going to prove what the profit is. That would be up to you to self report.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
863 Posts |
is it really tax fraud though? you are aloud to buy items at a yard sale without being taxed or claiming profit. what is the difference if you buy it from a private collector?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
808 Posts |
My attitude is always the same:
1) Cash transactions are inherently confidential. An informed seller and an informed buyer complete a transaction where fiat is exchanged for PMs. Simple as that. If the seller requests a name, it's Cash.
2) Taxes due are always paid. If I pay cash for a taxable transaction where it's the seller's duty to collect the tax, I reasonably assume the seller is including tax in the agreed price. I expect my vendors to always follow the law or I take my business elsewhere.
Edited by coinwatch
05/25/2012 02:04 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1454 Posts |
Quote:
is it really tax fraud though? you are aloud to buy items at a yard sale without being taxed or claiming profit. what is the difference if you buy it from a private collector? That's why I asked. Where is the line drawn? If you're regularly selling PMs, then you are running a business. But again, how much can you sell without reporting it as taxable income? Is this covered by the IRS in one of their tax code tomes? Anyone? |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
808 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1150 Posts |
This is why governments want all digital transactions; to track them all for tax purposes.
And yes, the only thing fraudulent mentioned in this thread is the IRS. Any agency that knowingly awards tax credits to people claiming non-citizen children in foreign countries has no business handling your money.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1454 Posts |
coinwatch,
That confirms what I was thinking. If the sale resulted in a capital gain, (i.e. one made more $ than one lost in the transaction, or series thereof) it's taxable. Wonder how many people have fudged that one? ;)
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
590 Posts |
This won't be a concern until PM skyrocket in price, which could happen, and the US government goes bankrupt, which could happen also. Then they will care a lot about your PM because the US dollar will be worthless. I would expect at that point taxes will the the least of your concern, they may want all your PMs in exchange for worthless green backs. Could happen.
I'm not anti-government nor do I promote criminal activity, unless it is for the preservation of self and family. I would say you are better off keeping quiet about your PMs to everybody especially the government. When things go bad the first thing they go after is your guns, and then everything else. It may sound crazy but it has happened before within the last 100 years. Could happen again. Always plan for the worst and hope for the best.
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Valued Member
Canada
442 Posts |
Might be worthy to point out that OP is from Canada. :) Don't know the laws in the US, but my experience is that buying from my LCS, they require ID, unless it's under $200. Not sure why. As for selling, it is not taxable as long as your total sell amount is under $1000. I'll have to find it on the CRA site. It goes under capital gains. Here's a thread over at the kitco forums: https://www.kitcomm.com/showthread.php?t=99373 |
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Valued Member
Canada
442 Posts |
Is it Just me or can I not find an edit post button? Just wanted to add this.. it pretty much summarizes everything said in my link: Quote:
Personal-use property
When you dispose of personal-use property, you may have
a capital gain or loss. To calculate this gain or loss, follow
these rules:
â- If the adjusted cost base (ACB) of the property is less
than $1,000, its ACB is considered to be $1,000.
â- If the proceeds of disposition are less than $1,000, the
proceeds of disposition are considered to be $1,000.
â- If both the ACB and the proceeds of disposition
are $1,000 or less, you do not have a capital gain or a
capital loss. Do not report the sale on Schedule 3 when
you file your income tax and benefit return."
When you dispose of personal-use property that has an
ACB or proceeds of disposition of more than $1,000, you
may have a capital gain or loss.
Adjusted cost base (ACB) -- usually the cost of a property
plus any expenses to acquire it, such as commissions and
legal fees.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Based on this wonderful discovery, I would advise Canadians to purchase only bullion that you expect to be saleable for less than 1000$/unit in order to avoid any capital gains on your bullion.
Given my long-term price targets of $6000/oz for gold and $300/oz for silver, that would mean 5 gram bars of gold (or smaller), and 3-oz bars of silver (or smaller).
Since the capital gains tax in Canada is based on 50% of the gain, taxed at your personal marginal tax rate (for the average person, around 30-35%), a typical capital gains tax on bullion would be about 15-18%. The tax loss of 15-18% upon sale of a 100oz bar of silver (which would be bought and sold for considerably more than more than $1000) outweighs any savings in terms of the lower premium over a 1oz round.
Therefore, this analysis suggest that Canadians should only be buying 1 oz silver, 1/10 oz fractional gold coins, or 5gr gold coins to maximize their eventual gains. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
808 Posts |
Quote:
Might be worthy to point out that OP is from Canada. :) An important distinction to make when talking about local laws and tax regs.  I think we're also mixing sales tax issues with questions regarding capital gains for income tax. Here in the US, federal law doesn't require ID or IRS notification for cash transactions under $10,000. However, some coin/bullion dealers may at their discretion require ID and IRS notification if they suspect illegal activity. |
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Valued Member
 Canada
178 Posts |
Vinnycoin, great information for Canadians thanks! Of course like most here selling the hoard it not something we want to consider. Of course this could change at any time. Then there are local laws: Quote:
Q: Does XXX report my sale or purchase of bullion to any government or financial agency?
A: Generally speaking ... no. All customer information is kept private in house and is not sold, leased or rented to any other person, company or agency. The information obtained is used only for the transaction at hand. However, if you are selling bullion to us in our Vancouver store, city bylaws do require that we obtain photo ID which shows your current address. This information is entered into a special Vancouver Police Department Anti-Theft website and is only used to search against goods reported stolen. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4008 Posts |
Quote:
I'm not a conspiracy theory type, I just think this is good common sense.
Is my tinfoil hat too tight or do you do the same? Like most on here, I agree with this 100% and, no, your tinfoil hat is not only not too tight, it isn't even on! If one is going to possess actual physical PMs, one needs to have good security to protect them. Keeping quiet about what you own is THE best insurance you can have against those cretins who feel entitled to the things for which others have worked and they have not. I don't even tell the members of my own family, who do not need to know, about my PM hoard. I trust them but not anyone else who might overhear them talking about it. Only my wife, parents, and son know about my PMs and each of them has a GOOD reason to know. |
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Posted 05/24/2012 7:53 pm
