1861 3 Cent Silver - Shattered Die Or Counterfeit?

It is an obvious fake, and it is a known contemporary fake.

Can either of you (Conder101 or Vermontensium) point me to an online reference of known contemporary counterfeits?

There is none that I know of, but I know of two people working on references on contemporary counterfeit trimes.

Funniest thing I'll read all day.

No clue why you had problems sending email - I'm not blocking it.

No it's not for sale, it's part of my circulated 3cs collection.

Interestingly pricing for 3CS counterfeits isn't that different than genuine coins.

I had the same discussion - about relative values - with the dealer I bought it from. He's a thoroughly reputable individual who was horrified that he had sold a counterfeit. I told him it was a perfect addition to my 3cs circulated set, so I was actually quite happy, but I wasn't going to pay him extra. I see him every so often at coin shows and he still doesn't know what to make of me.

My 2nd contemporary counterfeit 3cs was openly (although the legal side IS questionable) bought as such.

And there is another dealer who keeps one in his case (not for sale). I had a lovely discussion with him about CCs during a slow half hour at a show.

I think it is because I'm new....supposedly, you need a certain amount of posts/comments/etc before you can send private email to prevent robots and spam. Nothing on your side that prevented it.
As for legal or illegal, I'm not a lawyer, but I figure since Stacks et al sell contemporary counterfeits, I wouldn't worry about it. There is a dealer online with pages of contemporary counterfeits for sale. You might run into problems with current money, but I don't know.

It's a really great piece you have!

I have an 1861, hand cut dies in German silver. Another nice piece. I definitely liked the die break on yours though!!

As for value, like most things, whatever someone is willing to pay, and variety/rarity/metals/crudeness/etc all go into value. I sold a high grade Machin's Mill halfpenny for a couple hundred dollars. (VF), and a VG Machin's Mills for $7,500. One is much rarer....just like the genuine pieces. Another thing with counterfeits, is they go in and out of popularity....the highest I ever saw was in 2008. Also!! What is written about them? Are there plates? The reason counterfeit 2 reales and machin's mills are so popular is all the work done on them over the years, and that they were both made and circulated in colonial America. Spanish have always liked counterfeits. (falsas de epoca or falso de epoca or falsa de epoca), and you will pay a pretty high premium on them. I used to have quite a bit. An area that is still pretty reasonable is counterfeit 8 reales. In general, struck is better than cast, and errors, like dates outside the kings reign, wrong assayer initials for that mint etc command a higher price. English and Spanish gold pieces were counterfeited in platinum and then gold plated in the early 19th century. I've had several of those. Platinum was a byproduct of gold and silver mining, and they didn't know what to do with it....counterfeiters knew...it has a specific gravity slightly higher than gold, so would be ideal for making fake gold pieces!

Thanks for the response, and have fun collecting!!

Steve