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NCLT Coins Are Not Legal Tender, Including The $20 For $20

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canadian_coins's Avatar
United States
2408 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2016  11:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add canadian_coins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
LOL! Both are real lousy investments


Investment?

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Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 08/05/2016  09:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
First of all regarding NCLT, almost 98% of them will be available latter for much less than issue, at least with these types of x for x coins unless the RCM does an abrupt policy change there's no risk. A t the recent RCNA the senior rep that I chatted with had an insane view on what can and should be placed on a NCLT coin, which is anything that might sell a coin, ouch just don't get it at some point you will destroy the hobby. Lastly kind of enjoy every ones opinions and buy what you like, some how someway the RCM is still able to sell about 2/3 sell outs.
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Canada
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 Posted 08/05/2016  09:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:

By the way, I have never had any trouble cashing any face value coins at TD Trust.


This is the basis of my earlier comment. How does it benefit the hobby of coin collecting in general if XforX are only bought with the intention of cashing them in? "Where can I redeem them" is a #1 query in regards to XforX. As you strongly support NCLT collecting in general, I'm curious why you'd also buy, then redeem them and because, in my opinion, that neither benefits either the hobby nor RCM. (Aside from previously mentioned reasons that revolve around attaining higher MC status or benefiting by credit card points.)
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Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 08/05/2016  09:37 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I buy them for gifting, cooler than a 20.00 bill, but some designs are stupid, hopefully the people receiving the gifts will turn onto the hobby especially the younger ones
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Canada
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 Posted 08/05/2016  10:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think XforX is a great idea for gift giving, particularly significant when the giver is a coin collector but the recipient is not.

Did the RCM senior rep express an opinion about the future of XforX? The stated purpose of the face value program launched in 2011 was a "customer acquisition initiative", yet I haven't noticed any official comments of it's success, other than higher redemptions than anticipated in the most recent 1/4ly report.
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Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 08/05/2016  11:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
They do believe these x for x coins are reaching the objectives of getting new customers, and maybe they are, they surely cost the RCM a wack in just handling, shipping and future redeeming cost so I hope they meet their objectives. I know the 10 to 20 years old who I gifted really enjoyed these coins over say 5 twenty dollar bills. Part of the RCM problem is even with the x for x they just over do things and issue too many bad themes collectors lose interest and start redeeming.
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Redzapsid's Avatar
Canada
1571 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2016  8:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Redzapsid to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm still curious to know why the title of this topic hasn't been changed. All coins from RCM are legal tender. And can be redeemed for face value at banks. We might have the Queen on our coins but this isn't the UK.
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Canada
2845 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2016  9:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
When the first XforX was originally sold, the mint advertised them as legal tender. Of course people first thought they could be spent like cash. Probably some still do.

NCLT-Coins-Are--Not-Legal-Tender,-Including-The-$20-For-$20


Quote:

All coins from RCM are legal tender


Interesting, Canada's current definition and limitations of Legal Tender.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/...e-1.html#h-6

Even in Canada, there's maximum limits of circulation coins that represent "legal tender", unless the merchant or bank is agreeable in accepting them. In the past situations have arisen from time to time when someone wants to pay a disputed debt or bill out of spite with mountains of pennies. Nope.

Notice the reference to "Coins of denominations greater than ten dollars"?

I highly doubt that RCM would impose limitations, but the law is already in place of max one per day redemptions if they chose to apply it.
Edited by wildflowerAB
08/09/2016 9:42 pm
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Redzapsid's Avatar
Canada
1571 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2016  9:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Redzapsid to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yup, I've previously read the laws regarding legal tender several times.
And than I cashed in over $2000 worth of them at my local bank. I'm pretty sure that since I deposited them into my bank account, they're legal tender.
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Canada
2845 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2016  9:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Legal tender - definition
"coins or banknotes that must be accepted if offered in payment of a debt."

@ Redzapsid - your bank 'cashed' them for you because they value your business, not because they had to:-)
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Canada
6768 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2016  10:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silveroid to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
@ Redzapsid - your bank 'cashed' them for you because they value your business, not because they had to:-)


and because they (bank) has agreement with RCM - anyway previously your XforX will be sent to the Mint.
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Redzapsid's Avatar
Canada
1571 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2016  10:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Redzapsid to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So if I bring them a bag of sand with $25 written on it, will they credit my account to keep me as a customer? Of course not. The coins are minted by the government, and have a redemption policy in affect with financial institutions. The mint will not refuse these coins by banks.
I have a mortgage with my bank. Until I pay off my house, in a couple decades, I have a debt to settle with my bank. Therefore, I can and do use these coins as payment.
Using the logic that someone can refuse them as payment, one could say $50 and $100 bills are not legal tender. If you've ever been to agas station at night and may have seen a sign that reads "we do not accept $50 bills or greater". Clearly $50 and $100 bills are legal tender as they can be used to pay debts, buy merchandise, and be deposited into a bank account, under the authority of the government of Canada. If the government makes it and declares it legal tender, it is, whether it be a maze game on a coin, 100kg gold coin, or $1000 bill etc.
I tried looking for new topics on the Canadian NCIT (non-circulating illegal tender) section of this forum. I didn't find any.
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Redzapsid's Avatar
Canada
1571 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2016  10:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Redzapsid to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If legislation was passed governing the use of coins with a face value greater than $10, which is the highest face value coin ever in circulation in Canada, clearly there was thought put into the idea of people actually using these as legal tender. I've cashed them in at banks I don't even have accounts with, so to me, until the laws are changed, everything issued by the BOC or RCM is legal tender.
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Redzapsid's Avatar
Canada
1571 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2016  10:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Redzapsid to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
When the time comes to pay my property tax, I'm going to see if there is a way to pay by cash. If so, guess what I'm going to use! Tell me you think the government will pass on taking my money. Lol.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2016  10:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
When banks cash XforX it's similar to cashing a cheque - RCM is the drawer who pays the bank back.

Ordinarily one would not have to "cash" legal tender..... that be like -- cashing in cash?

The Bank of Canada is the govt agency responsible for supply and management of Cdn cash and currency, not RCM. RCM response to redemptions remained unchanged, first under the General category. There is no "policy" that banks or businesses are required to redeem XfoX and RCM can't pass laws.

http://www.mint.ca/store/mint/custo....V6qTWHjOerU


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