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 Replies: 92 / Views: 9,779 |
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Pillar of the Community
861 Posts |
Hi 732amran,
The FACT is hte only thing that really matters is if YOU like the coin. The known history and issues with the coin have been exposed and if you are happy with the coin, than you should definitely keep it. If, however, you are planning to later sell this coin, than you should be aware that you will almost definitely get the grade of AU details-burnished.....based on the last sale of this coin, you should expect around $1000.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1304 Posts |
Wow...I retract my former statement. Good detective work g048406.
Posting this coin for sale cracked out from the Mervis slab and not mentioning it is one thing. But putting up the removed slab from the original NGC holder prior to the Mervis sale takes this to a different level. I would contact Friscomint1793 and ask for an explanation now that you have all this additional information.
I too agree that you should still look this coin over in person. If you like it, keep it. S-170 is a tougher variety in higher grades.
Edited by EFLargeCents
09/06/2015 08:15 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7375 Posts |
 Friscomint obviously knew the coin used to be in the AU55 holder. Where the original AU55 label, or photo thereof, came from, I don't know. Hard to believe Frisco didn't know about the interim Mervis holder. 732amram, If you're happy with the coin, great. I'd probably have to return the coin, knowing what I know now. Terrific thread  |
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Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
Quote:
"This whole thing begs the question: was the present seller, who sold the coin to 732amram, aware of the current status of this coin? "
To my mind, likely not. Too much time has elapsed since the Mervis sale to believe the coin didn't change hands more than once; the seller is a businessman and needs to turn inventory. The possibility exists but circumstantial evidence - in the absence of anything else - argues against it. I wish those of you who just want to attack the OP would channel that energy into doing what he's doing instead. Numismatics would be better for your efforts, just like it is for his. |
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Valued Member
 United States
297 Posts |
No no no-------- Lable was intentional ----He writes it in the Description. The whole thing is confusing to say the least. I think there was a error with the images--and he put the original pictures--and I'm being the nice guy about it*. But why at the low price for a AU55 ? + a offer your price ? ---- sounds like smells like ----is NOT like--O boy-sh-t hit the fan and its hitting me back. So I totally believe --the Burnished part as fact --and burnt part as well---that's why coin looks horrid with the burnished label*. I find it hard to believe how such a mistake in imagery from Friscomint1793 happened if indeed its a mistake. They should completely comply to switch for a better coin. ( I always wondered why some of there coins --like the wreaths low grades are so poor--as bassel state are priced as AG or Fair--whatever. They got many many many coins to choose from. Let me be clear--boys en girls--------------A coin that's Burnt in a fire-or Burnished or Whizzed or ect --Im staying very far from it ! I think it became very clear now the state of the coin------U basically cant reverse a deliberate damage*. Thank u all for all your inputs on a very educational subject by far ! WOW
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1554 Posts |
friscomint aka CV McCawley is probably the largest seller of LC's in the world and has been for 20 years at least. Not only that, he has cataloged some of the most famous LC auctions in history along with Bob Grellman. He is a very honest and sincere man personally. Also an EAC member since the 80's and is held in high regard with the members..For the members of the CCF community to call into question his integrity in regards to his business practices, I say, do some research. friscomint will accept all returns, no questions asked....Personally I have dealt with them many times and have yet to have a problem, I've always been more than satisfied. so have other members of the CCF family. And NO, this is not a $1,000 coin. The S-170 LC in the state of preservation shown in both the Heritage photos and the OP's photos, books for well over $2,000.
Edited by 1893S
09/06/2015 11:59 am
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
Heck, I didn't know Friscomint was Chris McCawley. That changes everything. Not about the coin, but it sure as heck removes the seller from my list of things to ever worry about. I got this one from him at a show:  Made a bunch on the flip, if that gives you any idea of his business practice. |
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Valued Member
United States
297 Posts |
supperdave---- There is a red one up now--- you may love it 1820 exact same type with clear die castle break like this coin. So in other wards u made a killing on this one--is that what your sayin?
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Valued Member
United States
297 Posts |
Yes EFlargecents --I requested new pictures and ill see----------lol wow such a noise for a poor large cent that was meant to buy a loaf of bread way back then---ahaaa !
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1304 Posts |
1893s - I doubt very much that CVM manages the ebay store. He has a couple of folks who likely do that for him and run the business with him. With that said, I tend to believe that the Mervis insert didn't accompany the coin to CVM's inventory but the AU55 insert did. It was simply put up for sale with that insert and they took new photos of the coin and priced it accordingly. If the coin looks anything like it does in the ebay photos, it doesn't really matter what issues it has, it's a nice looking coin for a tough variety that in EAC30 (the EAC net grade given to this coin in the Mervis sale) books for $3000 in Penny Prices by Noyes. With that in mind I would say it was priced pretty well. As for why it sold so cheap at the Mervis sale, a number of factors. Bad photos (they were terrible photos Heritage took if the coin looks anything like the ebay photos). A lack of copper specialists that were bidding at the time (copper specialists are less likely to care about details issues like those listed, whereas registry collectors/investors are going to spurn the coin) are two such possibilities. The only unknown is whether or not they did know about the Mervis insert and went ahead with the AU55 insert over it. I would have NO problem with this auction if no insert was posted at all. The specialist can grade the coin with the really nice photos presented and with the return period and stand up business practices of CVM. I have bought many coins from them, all presented honestly and I have been nothing but pleased with my purchases. I'm also an EAC member. It is only speculation at this point on whether or not they did have the Mervis insert and chose to ignore it, and I choose to look at the coin and the seller and go with a more innocent explanation. OP, please give the coin an honest review. Ask any questions of Friscomint they will be happy to help I am sure. To a specialist in copper this coin is tough to beat for the variety. SSuperDdave - Wow nice coin! Here is a friscomint purchase of mine that I enjoy (and I bought it RAW from them):  Edited by EFLargeCents
09/06/2015 3:17 pm
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Pillar of the Community
861 Posts |
"1893s - I doubt very much that CVM manages the ebay store" Actually, friscomint1793 is not CVM)(Chris McCawley). friscomint1793 is his nephew. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7375 Posts |
I was wrong to insinuate that Frisco knew the coin was in a Details holder, it's very possible they didn't, and we'll never know for sure. Bottom line is, they accept returns if necessary.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1554 Posts |
All sales through friscomint are vetted through McCawley. All coins in frisco mint are purchased by MsCawley. His nephews help him because of his demanding road schedule. The buck starts and stops with McCawley.
EFLargeCents-You should know that CVM is friscomint as he has a one page color add with himself his nephew and the other guy on the last page of your Pennywise. It's common knowledge among EACers.
Edited by 1893S
09/06/2015 5:42 pm
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Pillar of the Community
861 Posts |
I'm sorry, but, based on the description in the listing, I would never purchase anything from this seller. Either he deliberately misled in his description of the coin or he is completely incompetent. The fact that both NGC and Heritage have stated that there are numerous problems with this coin and the seller didn't mention any of them ie burnishing, tooling, recoloring, cleaning, scratch etc. is very disturbing.
Edited by g048406
09/06/2015 6:15 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1304 Posts |
1893s - my meaning was that I doubt CVM micromanages the ebay store postings and photos. You said it yourself, he has a demanding schedule. The "other guys" name is Travis. The overall point I was trying to make is I doubt anything nefarious was going on with this listing. The coin was priced according to the net grade. It was appropriate. Copper is often cracked out for all sorts of reasons. If anything is taken away from this thread it is learn to grade coins and dont buy platic slabs with paper inserts. Buy the coin. Edited by EFLargeCents
09/06/2015 6:44 pm
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Replies: 92 / Views: 9,779 |
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Posted 09/06/2015 08:13 am
