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Crying Tonight About The Coin I Lost Out On On The Bay Tonight

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ExoGuy's Avatar
United States
4421 Posts
 Posted 12/21/2016  10:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Russ Rulau listed these tokens in the Hard Times "satirical" section of his 4th and last edition token catalog. Rulau dated these HT-6's to 1834, two years following Jackson's election to a second term. Thus, I'm unable to see how this issue was intended to promote Jackson in a positive light. Also, the chubby, dowdy Caesar bears no resemblance to the tough, lean General Jackson who was ever so popular among his commoner constituents.

I did some checking and found this .... (Julius Caesar in Western Culture - Wyke)

In January 1835, Richard Lawrence unsuccessfully attempted to assassinate Jackson in the rotunda of the Capitol. Whig (Jackson's opposition) rhetoric, comparing Jackson to Caesar was so heated that Francis P. Blair, editor of the Globe, suggested that Lawrence might have been influenced by the orators who, "had depicted the President as a Caesar who ought to have a Brutus." Even after he left office, his opponents continued to liken him to Caesar and his successors, the Roman emperors. (Jackson repudiated being likened to Caesar. He, himself, did not see this comparison as flattering.)
Edited by ExoGuy
12/21/2016 10:04 am
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billjones's Avatar
United States
1499 Posts
 Posted 12/21/2016  10:25 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add billjones to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I shall continue to disagree with you. I see the word "satirical" vertically on page 18 in Rulau where the early Low numbers are listed. These include the variations of Low 1 as well as the two "Gallent defender of New Orleans" varieties with Jackson on the obverse and an eagle on the reverse. If all of those tokens are "satirical," then there are no pro Jackson tokens, and I can't figure out what the joke is. If Rulau intended to call these varieties "satires" then he is wrong.

Low 1

Crying-Tonight-About-The-Coin-I-Lost-Out-On-On-The-Bay-Tonight Crying-Tonight-About-The-Coin-I-Lost-Out-On-On-The-Bay-Tonight

HTT 7

Crying-Tonight-About-The-Coin-I-Lost-Out-On-On-The-Bay-Tonight Crying-Tonight-About-The-Coin-I-Lost-Out-On-On-The-Bay-Tonight

BTW Jackson's would be assassin had two pistols which both failed to fire. At the time the odds of that happening were calculated to be some astronomical amount, I forget the exact figure.

If you believe in fate, it shows that some force was out to save Jackson. Washington also had three bullet holes in his coat during a French and Indian War battle.

Have a happy holiday!
Edited by billjones
12/21/2016 10:31 am
Bedrock of the Community
biokemist6's Avatar
United States
12437 Posts
 Posted 12/21/2016  1:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I don't agree with your assessment that it is harshly scrubbed.

Honestly, if you cannot recognize a coin that has obviously been harshly cleaned and damaged, you should strongly reconsider bidding on multi-hundred dollar coins until you can educate yourself better or else you are just throwing your money down a rat hole, never to be seen again
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ExoGuy's Avatar
United States
4421 Posts
 Posted 12/21/2016  6:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@billjones ... I see your first piece as being satirical in nature. The idea that the Union will be preserved and the banks must perish is ridiculous. Jackson would slay the banking industry? Preposterous. I do agree that the second piece you pictured is not satirical. I have this issue, myself. I would note however that Jackson's facial expression is such that he appears to be sucking lemons! As the majority of Jackson tokens do appear to be satirical, I suspect that Rulau simply included this latter piece in the series. He did separately list the campaign tokens, and I see this latter one as being closer in make-up, intent, to that grouping.

At the risk of being politically incorrect ... Merry Christmas!
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billjones's Avatar
United States
1499 Posts
 Posted 12/22/2016  08:00 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add billjones to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Now I understand your position, Expoguy.

With all due respect you really need to study the history and policies of Andrew Jackson. Low #1 is very popular because it hits two of the major issues of the Jackson presidency. "The bank must perish" refers to Jackson's "bank war" during which he successfully fought to prevent The Bank of the United States from getting a renewal of its Federal Government charter. It was THE major issue for the 1832 presidential election.

"The union must and shall be preserved" refers to Jackson's political battles with South Carolina, and the other southern states over the tariff laws. The protective tariff benefited the northeast state industries by raising the price of imports. For the South it amounted to a rise in the cost of living. Southerners opposed it, and threatened to "nullify " any Federal law that was not in their interests. Jackson recognized this as a threat to union and was ready to send Federal troops into those states to enforce the laws.

Astute observes, like John Quincy Adams, saw that slavery was in the mix in this controversy. The southern state politicians saw that the tariff was only part of it. If the North could interfere with slavery that would impinge in their rights as they saw it. Some historians view Jackson's readiness to send in Federal troops to enforce Federal law as a precursor to the Civil War.

I have run because I have pick up the in-laws for Christmas this morning. I have that what I have written here will help you understand the history surrounding these tokens. I've written several articles about this, and I think you can still find them on the Early American Coppers web site. You can reach it with a Google search.
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Fathead 5's Avatar
United States
294 Posts
 Posted 01/08/2017  7:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Fathead 5 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't see why not getting this coin is such a loss; it looks like it was badly cleaned and has significant rim damage. Consider yourself lucky that some other sucker outbid you.
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