Coin Community Family of Web Sites Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors
Specializing in Modern Numismatics Vancouvers #1 Coin and Paper Money Dealer Royal Estate Auctions - $1 Coin AuctionsJoin Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors Coin, Banknote and Medal Collectors's Online Mall 300,000 items to help build your collection! Royal Canadian Mint products, Canadian, Polish, American, and world coins and banknotes.








Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

Finn's Big Project - A Study Of The "Gadhaiya Paisa" And Related Coinage

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 92 / Views: 15,364Next Topic
Page: of 7
Pillar of the Community
Kamnaskires's Avatar
United States
7066 Posts
 Posted 05/07/2017  09:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kamnaskires to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well done, Steve! Worth the wait. I love the detailed analysis. Oh, if only my students would take the time to look - and describe - visual subject matter this way. A few years back I wrote a design textbook, which we use in-house for a number of sections of Design I, II, and III at the college where I teach. In it I devoted a chapter to formal analysis. I tried to encourage careful inspection of visual subject matter and the use of thorough, very descriptive language to explain what one sees. So often people - especially young people, it seems - gloss over the details.

I have had several people try to put a bug in my ear about KOINON, a new ancient-numismatics print publication being developed, with the goal of the first annual release being fall of 2018. They suggested I attempt to pull together a paper/article for consideration. Not sure if I will follow through, but it's a tempting idea. This work here, the comparative study you have developed, seems like an ideal basis for a paper. April 2018 is the deadline for submissions for consideration...let me know if you want more info.
Edited by Kamnaskires
05/07/2017 09:19 am
Pillar of the Community
Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 05/07/2017  3:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks Bob! I am glad that my work here is still being enjoyed! We're about halfway done with the study now, up next we finally get to the actual Gadhaiya paisa, then the really weird later types.

I'll have to think on submitting this for publication. Can you PM me the details of what they are looking for?
Pillar of the Community
Kamnaskires's Avatar
United States
7066 Posts
 Posted 05/07/2017  4:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kamnaskires to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I just sent you a PM, Steve.
Pillar of the Community
Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 05/08/2017  6:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Series 4 - Gadhaiya Paisa type

Area - Gujarat region
Time period - 950-1189 AD?
Attributed to - Chaulukyas of Gujarat
Overall rarity - Very common
Price range - $5-35

Fabric
Flan diameter - Medium/Small
Die size - Slightly larger than flan
Typical centering - Excellent
Strike quality - Very good
Thickness - Medium/thick
Weight - 3.9 to 4.5g
Typical wear - Light/Moderate
Silver purity - High/Medium

Design
Engraving skill - Good
Design relief - High

This is by far the most common. The Gadhaiya Paisa is distinguished from the Bent Head series in that the head is much more realistically shaped, and tends to run small enough that a significant portion of the headdress, ribbons, and shoulders are visible, all presenting now as a series of very fine dots. Of critical importance here is that some examples (we will assume them to be earlier types) have fading traces of the "line through they eye" that dominates series 2 and 3. In middle and later examples, this line disappears. The reverse is very much standardized, with the fire altar taking a clear pyramidal shape, and the attendants reduced to nothing but a pile of dots on top of two parallel lines. Toward the "end" of the series, the art style becomes more careless and the features grow in size as the flan shrinks. By the very end, the nose is nothing but a line, the head is nothing but a pill shape surrounded by a series of dots (representing the eyes, nose, mouth, and beard), and the attendants are almost always off-flan, as is most of the fire altar.


-----------------------------
Sub-type 1 - Orthodox style; Large head
-----------------------------
The transitional type from the Curved Head type and the more common Gadhaiya Paisa, these are characterized by a large, somewhat lima bean shaped head, and carefully engraved dies that fit most of the obverse and all or nearly all of the reverse.
4.01
16mm
4.13g
Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-
It's difficult to express how significant this find was for me. When I started this study, I was operating under the assumption/gut feeling that the Gadhaiya Paisa was a descendant of the Curved Head type; this coin provides proof. It's not difficult to see the relationship from the head shape, but there are some critical differences that define the Gadhaiya Paisa proper:
- The chin has become a dot hovering in front of the face, no longer connected to the rest of the head.
- The line through the eye is still present, but has become extremely thin; easy to miss if you are not really looking for it.
- The dots that make up the obverse and reverse are (with the exception of the eye and sometimes the head and breasts of hte attendants) uniform in size, and also more carefully sunk into the die.
- The ribbons now turn downward and run to the bottom of the die in a straight line

4.02
17mm
4.12g
Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-
Here we see the curvature of the head has dramatically reduced to a sort of hook at the back of the head. This example was struck a bit lower on the obverse die, so we can see the new shape of the ribbon, as well as the shoulder pads, which are two small tear-drop shapes well below the portrait.

4.03
l7mm
4.05g
Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-
This example may have been struck from nearly identical dies to the last one, which is highly unusual for Indo-Sassanian coins. This one is shifted a bit on the obverse die so that we can see the ribbons on both sides of the portrait.

4.04
15mm
4.12g
Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-
A slight step backwards in terms of quality here, the head is a bit more carelessly engraved, and the reverse is no longer fully present on the coin. The line through the eye is nearly gone; really only visible under good lighting and magnification at this point.
Pillar of the Community
Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 05/09/2017  2:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
---------------------------
Sub-Type 2 - Orthodox Style; Small head
---------------------------
Much like the above Orthodox style, these are very unusual in that they tend to show nearly all of the die impression on both sides. The head on this sub-series is smaller overall, with a small forehead and the curvature reduced to a little hook at the back. The dash through the eye is still present, but often difficult to see.

4.05
18mm
3.91g
Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-
This is the only Gadhaiya Paisa I have that shows the full die impression on both sides. The head is very small on the coin, which finally allows us to see every part of the obverse die. The reverse is also fully struck, which is quite unusual for Indian numismatics. The key differences to note here are that the head and breasts of the attendants seem to have been made with a slightly larger diameter chisel (or whatever was made to sink the dots into the die). The moon also wraps almost all the way in on itself. The surface of this coin is quite rough and the weight is very light, perhaps indicating a much lower silver content that underwent surface enrichment, much like the third century Roman antoninianii. Or perhaps whoever dug it up cleaned it too harshly.

4.06
18mm
3.92g
Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-
Almost exactly as above, but this coin sports a slightly thinner portrait and an off-center strike with large areas that were flat-struck. Somewhat better surfaces but the same low weight have me leaning toward the hypothesis that these coins are surface-enriched.

4.07
15mm
4.09g
Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-
Well, I am not entirely sure if this coin strictly belongs here, but it made the cut based on the shape of the head and the careful execution of the design elements. This coin is back up to normal weight on a much smaller flan, and the line through the eye is bolder than most we have seen so far. It is quite deeply and cleanly struck, and attractive in-hand.
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
Palouche's Avatar
Spain
2752 Posts
 Posted 05/10/2017  01:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Still following and learning

An excellent thread ..really informative.

Thanks for sharing.

Saludos Paul
Pillar of the Community
Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2017  02:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
-------------------------
Sub-type 3 - Intermediate style
-------------------------
Perhaps the result of a separate imitation event or shift in coinage policy, these coins suddenly become less carefully crafted on smaller, thicker flans. The weight also increases significantly, and some examples seem to be relatively low purity. Definitive characteristics include a large, less carefully engraved nose, smaller eyes (usually with the line through it, but at a 45 degree angle now) and a larger cheek. The flan also is usually oval, perhaps to fit more of the design than would be otherwise possible.

Note also that these coins simply share the above characteristics, and probably cannot be placed in any sort of chronological order.

4.08
16mm
4.26g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

This one is interesting due to the fact that the ribbons and hat slope downward rather than running straight across, like we have seen on nearly every coin so far. Whether this is just careless engraving, or a relation to 3.12 (my avatar), I don't know! I have also seen similar examples with a more "bent" head, and ones with very long noses. While the reverse is nearly complete on this coin, it is much more cramped, and seems to have been engraved with a less fine chisel. The moon is now an oblong crescent that folds nearly all the way in on itself.

4.09
15mm
4.34g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

The head shape here is similar to the previous example, but the ribbons and hat are a bit more straight. The line through the eye is much easier to see on this example, but still is slanted. Again, we can see that one side of the reverse is better struck and sharper than the other, probably due to the coin not being struck perfectly head-on.

4.10
14mm
4.41g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

A very distinctive head shape here that seems to turn up periodically in large lots. The head is very large on the coin, with small eyes and very large lips and a large cheek. In some odd way, this almost reminds me of the Olmec colossal heads from Central America. One important feature on the reverse is that the moon "opens" downward; I feel this is good evidence for my theory that the various features of the reverse were sunk into the die using a chisel and a series of punches.

4.11
14mm
4.20g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

As above, with a very slightly more "normal" head shape, and a more boldly struck reverse. Here the moon "opens" to the right.

4.12
15mm
3.90g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

This was actually the first Indo-Sassanian coin in my collection. Not especially noteworthy, except that it sports a reasonably bold line through the eye; this is the last we will see of this feature. This one is also much lighter than average for this intermediate type, but that could possibly be due to the damage to the flan.
Pillar of the Community
Justinokay's Avatar
United States
564 Posts
 Posted 05/27/2017  2:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Justinokay to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Great job Steve a very detailed report on these Indo-Sassanian coins. From the moment I look at your avatar picture I fell in love with these coins, because of not only of their "design" but also there unique shapes and sizes caused by hand striking the coins. And just a few clarification question:
-Were these coins circulated around the time of the Silk Road?
- And how wide spread are these coins during the time (from what region to what region)?

Justin
Edited by Justinokay
05/27/2017 2:20 pm
Pillar of the Community
Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 05/28/2017  6:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Glad the bug is spreading!

Unfortunately, I don't have solid answers to your questions. It's generally accepted that the "Indo-Sassanian" coins were adapted from the Hunnic empire coins, which were mostly imitated from the Peroz I drachms. The Hunnic empire collapsed in the late 7th century, and the design was preserved by a series of native Indian dynasties that probably were accustomed to trading with the Huns. These coins were made at the same time as the Silk Road was around, but the trade route was well past its prime when these coins really took off between about 850-1200 AD.

Because the coins are all anepigraphic, the timeline has (AFAIK) been reckoned based on the context of hoard finds, which have been considerable. The only "official" reference guide for these coins is "Imitations in Continuity" by K.K. Maheshwari. It is recent (published in 2010) and still in print, but runs about $85 when you can find a copy for sale. Supposedly, Maheshwari gives at least a few examples of hoard locations, the contents of such hoards, and evidence to point to the approximate date of burial. My understanding is that all major hoards have been found in NW India, specifically Gujarat which was a very wealthy sea port due to its location on the trade routes between the Chola empire at the tip of the peninsula, and the Middle East and Africa's eastern coast. It's the same region that gave us the Western Satrap drachms, as well as the Gupta and post-Gupta Maitraka drachms, so there is a pretty well established reliance on silver to fuel the local economy.
Pillar of the Community
Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 06/01/2017  01:33 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
-------------------------
Sub-type 4 - Degenerate Style
-------------------------
There really isn't any good way to describe these except careless. The most striking features are that the line through the eye has now disappeared completely, and the nose, lips, and eye vary quite a bit in terms of size and "realistic" engraving.

4.13
14mm
4.21g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

A reasonably unremarkable specimen that seems to be moderately worn. Not much to note here except that the line through the eye is now gone, and the eye is just a tiny dot. The face is devoid of pretty much any "human" feeling by this point; it is a schematization and nothing more.

4.14
16mm
4.22g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

This one isn't *so* bad. It has some eye appeal and a decent strike, plus some mineral deposits on the reverse that I'll have to try to soak off. Under very powerful magnification, there may be a fading trace of a line through the eye, but it is difficult to tell if that was intentional. Finally, it is a very subtle change, but the upper lobe of the ear now points straight downward, rather than back to the head as teh earlier Gadhaiya Paisa do.

4.15
15mm
4.26g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

Yikes! Look at that eye! This one is pretty sloppy all around, with a careless nose and even a few crooked lines in the ribbon. The flan is much too small to capture any significant detail on the reverse.
Pillar of the Community
Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 06/01/2017  12:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
4.16
16mm
4.17g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

This one reminds me quite a bit of 4.08; perhaps a reminder that there is no "linear" path through these coins. Again, no line through the eye, which here is fused with the head shape. The lips interestingly are not little dashes like on the rest of these coins, but rather just dots. Not much of the reverse is present besides the fire altar.

4.17
14mm
4.43g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

This one I feel is likely related to 4.10, based on the shape of the nose and the size and placement of the very small eye (again, no dash here, even under magnification.) The reverse, importantly, is becoming confused. Since the attendants became a series of uniform dots early in the Curved Head series, the necklace has always presented as four dots above the breasts, forming half of a semicircle around the head. This coin has only three dots, and there is an extra dot between the head an the sun; either the missing piece of the necklace, or simply a sign that the engraver had no clue what they were supposed to be copying. At any rate, it is actually a nice looking coin in hand in high grade and very deeply struck. This is the only Gadhaiya Paisa I own that has no major flan cracks.

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

4.18
14mm
4.38g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

Another interesting late style, this time with a huge "eye socket" and a fairly large eye sitting low on the face. Here we can see the moon on the reverse once again, opening to the right. The attendant's pieces are all accounted for, althoug the necklace does extend a bit higher than normal.

4.19
14mm
4.43g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

This one is just plain goofy looking. The engraver does not appear to have been particularly skilled, and the portrait is only superficially resembling a human face at this point. The extra curvy ribbon in front of the lips is interesting; we haven't seen this style of ribbon since the previous series. Sadly, not enough of the reverse is on-flan to give any meaningful analysis.

4.20
16mm
3.96g

Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The- Finn's-Big-Project---A-Study-Of-The-

I have never seen anything like this coin before or since buying it! It superficially resembles the rest of the Gadhaiya Paisa in this series, but it has no eyes, and the lips have been replaced by a circle! The nose is also of a much different shape than we have seen before, with the nostril sitting about halfway up its length. Although I cannot offer any explanation for the circle, this may be the missing link between the Gadhaiya Paisa proper and the later Sri Omkara types! As with 4.17, the reverse seems to be lacking clear attendants--too many dots are off flan to be certain, but there seems to be just two parallel lines of dots running from the arms up to the top of the flame.

And that is it for the Gadhaiya Paisa! We still have some very late types left in this series, followed by the Pratihara-Pala track, so stay tuned!
Moderator
Learn More...
Spence's Avatar
United States
34424 Posts
 Posted 06/01/2017  3:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
And that is it for the Gadhaiya Paisai


Really nice work.
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
Pillar of the Community
Kamnaskires's Avatar
United States
7066 Posts
 Posted 06/02/2017  5:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kamnaskires to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Really nice work.


Absolutely. Such an outstanding, impressive thread. Perfect example of why the hobby is worth defending. Great work, Steve. Very much looking forward to the Pratihara-Pala chapter...
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
Palouche's Avatar
Spain
2752 Posts
 Posted 06/02/2017  6:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well what can I say...............

I've thoroughly enjoyed this thread and have realised how much effort you've put into sharing this information...,., I have learnt so much !!

Thank you for sharing it with us.

Saludos Paul



Pillar of the Community
Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 06/03/2017  2:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks all! I have had a lot of fun writing it, so it really means a lot that I haven't just been writing it for my own benefit! I am hoping to be able to crank out the updates a bit more quickly in the next weeks or months, but I am actually going to have to re-write my Series 1 since I was able to win a job lot of very early coins that has forced me to reconsider the original ordering I had for them.
  Previous TopicReplies: 92 / Views: 15,364Next Topic
Page: of 7

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



    




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.5 seconds to rattle this change. Forums