| Author |
 Replies: 45 / Views: 5,189 |
|
|
|
Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
Quote:
As with any higher value coin, I have to wonder why the consigner did not have it slabbed.
This is one a knowledgeable dealer wouldn't bother slabbing. The toning is advanced enough to risk an "Environmental Damage" label, at which point prospective buyers stop looking at the coin and start looking at the label. Yes, it'll limit his audience. To the experts, who will make rational decisions based on the coin and not the "designation." This is a pricey coin in AU or better, and (to my mind) indisputably original. That counts for something. The images are as unflattering as they could be; I could probably make it look quite a bit better with careful light placement. The coin wouldn't be any different, just how you look at it. Just like you could do at home without a camera involved, by changing light source and angle. |
|
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1267 Posts |
Quote:
This is one a knowledgeable dealer wouldn't bother slabbing. The toning is advanced enough to risk an "Environmental Damage" label, at which point prospective buyers stop looking at the coin and start looking at the label. Yes, it'll limit his audience.
To the experts, who will make rational decisions based on the coin and not the "designation." This is a pricey coin in AU or better, I would like to think that the knowledgeable dealers would be honest enough to expose to any potential buyer that the coin in question is possibly environmentally damaged, even on consignment. There is a learning curve in this hobby, and that could be a very expensive lesson for some. The "experts" might not need another opinion, but why hide the truth from the lesser informed? Laura over at Legend I would deem a highly knowledgeable dealer, yet everything on her site is in PCGS and cac stickered. I can only judge this coin from the images provided, and I don't like what I think I see. Having it in a slab would either confirm my suspicion or, if it was straight graded, might have me give the coin a second look. Again, JMHO |
|
Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
Quote:
I would like to think that the knowledgeable dealers would be honest enough to expose to any potential buyer that the coin in question is possibly environmentally damaged, even on consignment The only difference between your avatar coin and Environmental Damage is how long the toning process was allowed to proceed. I would like to think that somebody could look at this coin and realize it's in late-stage toning without being told so by a TPG. "Environmental Damage" is their term for it, not mine. I call it "late stage toning," which is non-judgmental. |
|
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1267 Posts |
Quote: The only difference between your avatar coin and Environmental Damage is how long the toning process was allowed to proceed. I would like to think that somebody could look at this coin and realize it's in late-stage toning without being told so by a TPG. "Environmental Damage" is their term for it, not mine. I call it "late stage toning," which is non-judgmental. Exactly......BUT.... once the toning process has been allowed to proceed past the point of actually providing a protective layer which is beneficial to the coins surface, it actually has a detrimental effect and can be considered corrosion. Let me give you the PCGS definition...... Quote:
PCGS defintition.
corrosion
Damage that results when reactive chemicals act upon metal. When toning ceases to be a "protective" coating and instead begins to damage a coin, corrosion is the cause. Usually confined to copper, nickel and silver regular issues, although patterns in aluminum, white metal, tin, etc., also are subject to this harmful process. If the coin in question is in, as you put it, late stage toning, it is no longer stable and will continue to degrade over time. Should not prospective customers be made aware? Not all are as knowledgeable as others, and what an expensive lesson. Heck, even many experts rely on the TPG opinions..... As far as my avatar coin, it has remained stable and completely unchanged since at least 1994 when Phil Flanagan purchased it. I have no doubt it will remain that way for a very long time. Again, JMHO |
|
Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:
The "experts" might not need another opinion, but why hide the truth from the lesser informed? The seller believes it's original and came from being stored in a leather pouch. As far as why it isn't slabbed you would have to ask the consignor. They gave a pretty big raw coin consignments and looks like they didn't want any of them slabbed. If the consignor did want them all sold raw that seller would respect the consignors wishes. There are other raw coins in the consignment where things that would get a details grade are disclosed like saying it was cleaned ect. Edited by basebal21
11/27/2017 11:12 pm
|
|
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1267 Posts |
Quote:
There are other raw coins in the consignment where things that would get a details grade are disclosed like saying it was cleaned ect. Then I certainly give my respect to the seller. It is very possible that the coin in question has not reached the point of no return. As I've said before, I can only judge this coin from the images provided, and they are not great. I wish you had chimed in earlier, it certainly moves the pendulum a little. I guess I am a little cynical when it comes to expensive raw coins, and for good reason. Why would anyone leave so much money on the table when a reasonably inexpensive trip to the tpgs add so much value? It does happen though, just not very often. |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
3479 Posts |
Anyone care to disclose what outfit is selling this lot? Not interested in this coin but would take a peek at others.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Gerry Fortin is the one selling it. Quote:
. Then I certainly give my respect to the seller. It is very possible that the coin in question has not reached the point of no return. As I've said before, I can only judge this coin from the images provided, and they are not great. I wish you had chimed in earlier, it certainly moves the pendulum a little.
I guess I am a little cynical when it comes to expensive raw coins, and for good reason. Why would anyone leave so much money on the table when a reasonably inexpensive trip to the tpgs add so much value? It does happen though, just not very often. I have no idea why the consignor wanted them sold raw but it looks like they did. Quick glance and it looks like the ones slabbed in that collection were only old ANACS holders. I'm cynical about expensive raw coins too, but I do know he wouldn't force grading on a consignor if they didn't want it and I'm guessing they might just be an anti TPG type. |
|
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1267 Posts |
Quote: I'm cynical about expensive raw coins too, but I do know he wouldn't force grading on a consignor if they didn't want it and I'm guessing they might just be an anti TPG type. I got a better look at the coin on the website. While the toning does nothing for me personally, it does not appear to have reached the point of no return, nor do I see any evidence of corrosion. Again, this is only from what I can see in the images which while better than in the original post, still leave a lot to be desired. Mr Fortin, in my humble opinion, had nothing to disclose. FWIW, I still would prefer to have seen it in a TPG slab. Edited by hadleydog
11/28/2017 01:17 am
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote: I got a better look at the coin on the website. While the toning does nothing for me personally, it does not appear to have reached the point of no return, nor do I see any evidence of corrosion. Again, this is only from what I can see in the images which while better than in the original post, still leave a lot to be desired. Mr Fortin, in my humble opinion, had nothing to disclose. FWIW, I still would prefer to have seen it in a TPG slab. I completely agree. I don't think he was hiding anything or that it's something that couldn't be reversed if someone wanted too and that the natural sunlight pictures might be making that look worse than it is. I'd prefer to see it slabbed too since I'd just end up sending it in anyway if I was the buyer, the consignor is certainly making the sale harder with some of them keeping them raw. This coin is almost the poster child for I wish it had a TrueView to get another look at it with different lighting. |
|
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1267 Posts |
Quote:
This coin is almost the poster child for I wish it had a TrueView to get another look at it with different lighting.  |
|
Pillar of the Community
5464 Posts |
 but it would be a perfect Christmas gift for me.  |
|
Moderator
United States
189203 Posts |
Sneaky.  |
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
1261 Posts |
Thanks everyone for voting on this poll. It looks like people are pretty much 50/50 on whether they like the toning on this coin. Haha...just joking. It appears it is overwhelming "no" but I'm sure it looks better in hand. I wasn't interested in the coin personally but just thought the toning was interesting and wanted to put up a poll to see what people's thoughts were about toned coins like this. Now I know!
|
|
Valued Member
United States
383 Posts |
Would have to see it in hand. From the image provided, I'd have to say no sir... I don't care for it.
ET
|
| |
Replies: 45 / Views: 5,189 |
First Page
Previous Page
Posted 11/27/2017 10:00 pm
