1964 SMS Lincoln Memorial Cent / LMC Questions. I Just May Have It.

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Author	Replies: 26 / Views: 5,481	Page: of 2
Flyingfire00 Valued Member 58 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 12:39 pm I was wondering if the same die's used for the 1964 SMS cent, were used for business strike coins? Or were they only used for those specific struck coins? I have a 64 LMC that has the characteristics and die marks as the elusive cent. Diagonal polishing marks on the obverse with beautiful EDS. The reverse shows die marks in the left columns like the same coin on Heritage auctions website. I can't find any information if the same dies were used and passed the same marks or if I hit the coin jackpot. Thank you. Edited by Flyingfire00 02/19/2019 2:18 pm Report this Post to the Staff

Errers and Varietys Bedrock of the Community United States 75192 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 12:49 pm To CCF! I am pretty sure the SMS dies were only used for the SMS only. Errers and Varietys. Report this Post to the Staff
Flyingfire00 Valued Member 58 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 1:24 pm If that is the case then a 1964 LMC with the same markers could very well be SMS? Report this Post to the Staff
coop Bedrock of the Community United States 62064 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 2:38 pm Just a normal coin. The SMS examples on the cents were very fresh dies. (EEDS Early-Early-Die-State coins) If they struck 100, they were a different strike purpose to replace the proof cents of 1965-1967 years. The cent coin examples were show no die wear on OBV and REV. The strikes were stronger: Report this Post to the Staff
Flyingfire00 Valued Member 58 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 2:46 pm I was referring to the die markers. From the left in the second and 4th column there are specific markers used to indentify the 64 SMS correct? My coin has those same markers. My question was if they used the same dies for business strikes or not. Would business strike coins have the same die marks. Report this Post to the Staff
Flyingfire00 Valued Member 58 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 2:48 pm I posted 2 of the same pictures you posted. Just zoomed in to see the exact markers I am asking about. Report this Post to the Staff
coop Bedrock of the Community United States 62064 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 2:56 pm The die states are way different. The die strike are are different. In order to be from these pair of dies, it would have to be in the same die state and have all the same markers. Your is not a SMS. These probably never left the mint sets because of the very, very short run. They may have re-used the same dies later on, but they were not the fresh SMS strikes. What does the obverse of your coin look like? Also what does the 'A' on STATES look like on your coin? Edited by coop 02/19/2019 3:00 pm Report this Post to the Staff
jasper62 Pillar of the Community United States 2189 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 2:56 pm I know exactly nothing about the 1964 SMS but your last picture of the reverse looks to be an exact match to the one that coop provided a picture of from hertagecoin.com Report this Post to the Staff
Flyingfire00 Valued Member 58 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 3:16 pm Ok so back to my question....... were the dies retired after making the 64 sms or were they used again for business strikes? "They May have been re-used again" does not cut it for me. That is a guess on your part. The obverse of my coin has the same lateral die polishing marks and very good EDS with good seperation from the rim. I am willing to bet you are going to ask for a picture of that? I simply just wanted to know if the dies were ever used again. Not a explanation as to why you "know" it's not. Everything you have expressed I have already read and reasearched. Haven't found anything about the dies and what happened to them after. So back to my original question... Report this Post to the Staff
coop Bedrock of the Community United States 62064 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 5:06 pm Sometimes proof dies that go through their run, are reused on business strike coins. 1956-1964 quarters were reused in the Philadelphia mint and they were labeled type-B reverses. So they may continued after that run of Aprox 100 (Probably a lot less) sets, and continued to use this same reverse. That is why I wanted to see images of the obverse to see if it was a match with the know markers and the STATES area on the reverse of your coin. Report this Post to the Staff
jbuck Moderator United States 190113 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 5:51 pm to the Community! Coin Collector Since 1978 Avatar Old Avatar 7070 Eisenhower Australia Canada World CCF Members on eBay CCF eBay Search Engine Report this Post to the Staff
Flyingfire00 Valued Member 58 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 6:12 pm I will take more pictures this evening to show what I have found with them . Report this Post to the Staff
Flyingfire00 Valued Member 58 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 7:05 pm Another picture of the known markers. My coin shows the exact markers Report this Post to the Staff
Petespockets55 Pillar of the Community United States 5802 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 7:52 pm I hope you hit the coin jackpot but there appears to be a large die chip between column 1 & 2 on the Heritage example? Does your coins have that die chip? Please post an image of the full reverse. Words of encouragement are one of the major food groups. We need to consume them regularly to thrive and grow. Report this Post to the Staff
Flyingfire00 Valued Member 58 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 8:04 pm Not every sms has the die chip. That is only one example just FYI Report this Post to the Staff
Flyingfire00 Valued Member 58 Posts	Posted 02/19/2019 11:46 pm First picture is my coin next to a 1964 LMC proof. Not a proof Followed by it next to the 1965, 1966, and 1967 SMS coins. Then next to the 1965, 1966 SMS. The rest of the pictures shows the polished die markers that have me wondering about this coin. Notice on the obverse there are the lateral polish marks all over. Really noticeable by LIBERTY, Lincolns nose, along his portrait down to underneath the date, all through the date. I would think to say it is safe to say good EDS overall. Good seperation from the rim. Great looking strike. The reverse shows the same characteristics. I am no expert by all means but you examine a coin long enough and can see the same marks. All I have to go on is pictures online like everyone else. Seeing the same things lead me to believe it very well could be. I didn't find it in circulation. I look through antique shops as much as I can. This coin came from a estate sale I guess. I am having it looked at this weekend by a PCGS dealer. Definitely need to get it checked out. Along with the other one... yup! There was TWO! Both have the same markers! The last picture shows them both with a proof. & Report this Post to the Staff
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1964 SMS LMC Questions. I Just May Have It.