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Reminded Me Of A Roman Way Of Thinking, A Quote I Heard Today

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louisvillekyshop's Avatar
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 Posted 02/21/2022  8:45 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
In the news they were saying countries are thought of by Russia as "either a vassal state or enemy". Kind of sums up how Rome saw the world probably.
Edited by louisvillekyshop
02/21/2022 8:45 pm
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ijn1944's Avatar
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 Posted 02/22/2022  08:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ijn1944 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
As Maximus Decimus Meridius would say "Are you not entertained?"
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 Posted 02/22/2022  11:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add travelcoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Louis, in a way, you are absolutely right. Rome gave the title "Friend and Ally of the Roman People" to states that would ally with them, but they still had to pay tribute to avoid a full occupation. At least that's my understanding of the term.
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louisvillekyshop's Avatar
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 Posted 02/22/2022  4:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I find it interesting how he wants to go back to Tsar of Russia time which comes from Caesar as we know the title not Soviet times. His very long speech I played in my lab as I was grading where he off the cuff talks history as he sees it and throws the Communists all under the bus with mistake after mistake. Ukraine is old Russia and Lenin created Ukraine in Putins world view so he was sarcastic that Ukrainians got rid of Lenins statues to decommunize the country. He said they should have kept his statues as he was the only reason they were even considered a country and he left them with he'd now show them how to really decommunize. Some of the stuff did not translate well and probably sounded better in Russian. Like the march of Nato he equated to a caravan and that Russia would not this time be just the dog barking at the caravan. Anyway, he does think like an old Imperial emperor doesn't he.
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Sap's Avatar
Australia
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 Posted 02/22/2022  11:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To the Roman mindset, there were three types of foreign countries:
- Places that were worth conquering, and easily conquerable. Such places were conquered and assimilated, one by one. "Friends of Rome" who allowed the conquest to happen without resistance were allowed to pretend to remain autonomous, but everyone knew the autonomy was a sham.
- Places that were worth conquering, but difficult to conquer. If they were heavily-defended neighbours, such places were "the enemy", and involved with perpetual wars for dominance. Carthage and Persia/Parthia/Sassania being the obvious candidates here. If they were not neighbours, then they were largely irrelevant to Rome's ambitions until and unless they became neighbours. Faraway places like India, Axum and China were places that Rome was aware of the existence of (because of trade links), and were obviously valuable targets for conquest, but were simply too far away to conquer.
- Places that were not worth conquering, due to the lack of resources and potential slaves. Scotland, Germany and the Sahara Desert are standout candidates here.

Roman politicians knew the Roman economy was expansion-fuelled, requiring a constant inflow of plunder and slaves, and that meant they needed a large army for defence and expansion of the Empire, but they also knew that a large army, if left idle for too long, would go rogue and either seize control in a coup, or go rampaging and looting some place politically undesirable. So they needed to keep the army constantly occupied with warfare, preferably warfare that involved lots of rampaging and looting. Thus, Rome's crisis under Hadrian: after 3 centuries of continuous expansion across the Mediterranean, they'd finally run out of those worth-conquering-and-easily-conquerable targets.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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 Posted 02/23/2022  1:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add travelcoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sap, a well written and easily understandable explanation. Thank you
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