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Just An FYI - Charlton Standard Catalogue Of Canadian Government Paper Money

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walk2dwater's Avatar
Canada
2571 Posts
 Posted 12/31/2023  11:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add walk2dwater to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
..The high speed printing process and the automatic techs used today does not need a human intervention of replacing damaged notes with special desisignated notes so most collectors have lost intersts in these maybe rare inserts notes. The US BOE recently has announced that starting in new year some denomintions will be printed not in sequence, so they must be stepping up newer techs in the printing process..

+1


Quote:
I wonder what happened to all the rest of the print range?

You are assuming that the sheets(prefixes) were all serial numbered & fully issued. As John100 alludes to, we have to discard our old notions that all prefixes were issued equally & they were sequentially numbered #0000001 to 10000000. The numbering (& prefix) system could have started high & ended low (as many countries do). They could have easily started at the FTH prefix & ran out of the Macklem Carney sheets as they approached FTA (or some other prefix). We just don't know.

A similar situation occurred with the 2003 (Journey) BER prefix. More 2004 BER were recorded in the SNDB & the SNDB was launched due to the discrepancies discovered in the varying prefixes. This has also happened/been observed with the 2004 HOH $5 (more 2005 HOH observed- mostly inserts) & other prefixes (especially change-overs). And this is one of the reasons I was surprised it took Charlton so long to acknowledge the M-C FTH (actually rating the M-P FTH as more scarce in earlier editions).

I'm also a little surprised that they knocked the M-P FTH down to $17 in G-Unc too as these were plentiful but not as common as the W-P FTN ($60 in G-Unc). That's a real head scratcher!
Valued Member
Canada
98 Posts
 Posted 12/31/2023  12:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Q60driver to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The high speed printing process and the automatic techs used today does not need a human intervention of replacing damaged notes with special desisignated notes so most collectors have lost intersts in these maybe rare inserts notes. The US BOE recently has announced that starting in new year some denomintions will be printed not in sequence, so they must be stepping up newer techs in the printing process



Quote:
You are assuming that the sheets(prefixes) were all serial numbered & fully issued. As John100 alludes to, we have to discard our old notions that all prefixes were issued equally & they were sequentially numbered #0000001 to 10000000


It all seems so random now. I guess the serial numbers and prefixes don't really mater to the BOC as long as they're all different and they count how many left the building, as they would need to know how many are in circulation.
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Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 12/31/2023  1:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
All the BOC cares is cost of production and a certain level of security
Edited by john100
12/31/2023 3:55 pm
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walk2dwater's Avatar
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 Posted 01/03/2024  12:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add walk2dwater to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I guess the serial numbers and prefixes don't really mater to the BOC


Quote:
All the BOC cares is cost of production and a certain level of security


That's been my understanding. I met a former BoC official at a RCNA show years ago & he told me (in confidence) that he was astonished that collectors seek insert replacements. (I tend to agree) but I sure like the odd rare short prefix or change over.
Valued Member
Canada
98 Posts
 Posted 01/05/2024  4:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Q60driver to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
he was astonished that collectors seek insert replacements. (I tend to agree)


I feel the same. Insert replacements are very random with no rhyme or reason. I prefer collecting the old asterisk or X replacements.

As for the 2024 Charlton catalogue, I have updated all of my spreadsheets with the new catalogue numbers. My denomination collection had a minor increase of 1.4% with the few small changes coming from the older series (1935, 1937, 1954 devils face and modified)

My 1973 prefix set was virtually unchanged with the exception of one note. *OL dropped in value by $25 witch decreases my set by 0.185%. I expected an increase in test notes but none were made.

When comparing the 2023 and 2024 catalogue, I found the only changes were to the super rare stuff. 1937 $50 Osborne for example. Overall changes in the book are very minor.
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Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 01/05/2024  4:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Charlton is only good on mostly common stuff, the really rare like the serial 007 French 20 dollar young Princess sold twice in about a year for about 140 K books for like 25 k, rare serials like 01 or 10 million notes, really cool errors are all 5 to 10 times book. Recent auctions are the only way to determine true value, with inserts and maybe replacements few knows about them also they rarely trades, when collectors understand like the 5$ CB replacement they will pay up as recent auctions have proven
Edited by john100
01/05/2024 4:59 pm
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walk2dwater's Avatar
Canada
2571 Posts
 Posted 01/05/2024  5:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add walk2dwater to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Charlton is only good on mostly common stuff, the really rare like the serial 007 20 dollar young Princess sold twice in about a year for about 140 K books for like 25 k, rare serials like 01 or 10 million notes, really cool errors are all 5 to 10 times book. Recent auctions are the only way to determine true value, with inserts and maybe replacements few knows about them also they rarely trades, when collectors understand like the 5$ CB replacement they will pay up as recent auctions have proven


+1
John100 really sums it up nicely (I believe). Back in 2014, I wanted to upgrade my 1935 set but almost everything listed on ebay was sold by US sellers in USD. And the majority of the US sellers used Charlton (or the SCWPM) as their guide. That meant that most 1935, 1937 & 1954 DF's were 30-40% higher in reality than the book. So, I waited & waited until another year passed (with few acquisitions). About 2-3 years later I realized I had to dismiss Charlton b/c it simply did not match the market place for the first 3 series. Besides special # (which are off too), Charlton is pretty close for the Modified & more recent series.

A lot of US collectors snap up Canadian notes b/c they're pretty cheap for their rarity (& many US collectors know they get a good "bang for their buck" exchange on our colourful first 3 series). That's why I wrote my predictions (thinking the pricing panel & editor would finally acknowledge where they've been dragging their feet). I understand they like to be conservative with their BV/tables but I think they're "erring on the side of caution" a little too much. This is good for the dealers but terrible for the avg collector (who may be looking to sell).
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