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 Replies: 15 / Views: 700 |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11888 Posts |
IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.com |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
74223 Posts |
The obverse shows a lot of bag marks. The reverse is pretty clean of bag marks. I'll say MS-63.
Errers and Varietys.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3647 Posts |
Teachers have a tough job. Some days are rougher than others. Miss Williams had a very rough day on this day. (The eagle also had abdominal surgery, but still had a much better day.)
I don't see signs of circulation on the reverse, but there is what looks like surface disturbance on the usual high spots on the obverse. I'm iffy on this coin. The heavy bag marks on the obverse - especially the SW-NE scar on the cheek and the deep gouge above the scar - really hurt this coin. The strike and original surfaces are beautiful, and this one left the mint as a fantastic coin. It would have been an old school semi-prooflike (SPL).
Because of the reverse, I'm leaning toward UNC here. I think the obverse hits and the scar on the lower part of the eagle's breast are enough to detail the coin, though. To my eyes, it's either a net-graded MS-61 or UNC details. By itself, the reverse could have made MS-63 if the deeper gash didn't detail it. If it was deemed lightly circulated and considered a slider, I wouldn't be surprised, though. No matter what, at the price you paid it's worth buying.
(I'm a sucker for the Morgans, and I couldn't leave that one behind at that price, either. Despite all the bag hits, it still has underlying beauty and history.)
Edited by fortcollins
11/23/2025 12:45 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
36745 Posts |
Pretty baggy, MS-62. Nice buy for the money.
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
11888 Posts |
Quote:
I think the obverse hits and the scar on the lower part of the eagle's breast are enough to detail the coin, though. My understanding of grading is that bagmarks are not a reason for a details designation. Which details category would this fall under? IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.com |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3647 Posts |
For PCGS, a 95 code. For all of the TPGs, the location, depth, number, and severity of scratches seem to determine whether a coin is detailed.
That's why I focus on the deeper gouges. The superficial field dings shouldn't do it, but gouges that remove metal are problematic (like the hit just east of the hair above the ear on this coin).
Surface dings either seem to affect the grade itself or may be part of a "net grade" adjustment, which is obviously a controversial idea in its own right. The TPGs seem to deny that they "net grade" coins, but we've all seen cases that don't seem to have any other explanation. I would consider an inexplicable downgrade of more than one step to be a net grade. That's also why I see a strong need for creation of three new grading steps: EF-48 for certain, and probably also VF-38 and F-18.
Grade variances of a step are normal, so seeing this coin as a 61-62-63 is probably the expected zone, and a grade anywhere in that zone would be reasonable.
JMHO.
Edited by fortcollins
11/23/2025 3:06 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11888 Posts |
Thanks for taking the time to explain your thinking.
IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.com |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3647 Posts |
The depth of the ding west of the hair over the ear is also part of wondering if the coin may be lightly circulated. I, too, don't know what bag contact could cause a dig like that. It's too narrow and deep for a rim-to-surface contact.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11888 Posts |
For circulation, I'd be looking for breaks in luster or wear. I don't see indications of either.
IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: " It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." My coin website: https://fairfaxcoins.com |
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5394 Posts |
62 all day long in today's world!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1512 Posts |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10542 Posts |
Dings, nicks, agree with 62
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2170 Posts |
Yes, I would also go with MS62. Nice reverse, though, which might push it to an MS63...  |
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Valued Member
United States
398 Posts |
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Moderator
United States
188560 Posts |
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
18665 Posts |
one component of a 95 assignment is movement of metal on deeper marks. if they would grade it straight i'd see at on the higher end of MS62
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Replies: 15 / Views: 700 |
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Posted 11/23/2025 12:36 pm
