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 Replies: 49 / Views: 7,485 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1285 Posts |
I posted this on Page of 4 " VAM Rarity Question" topic. https://goccf.com/t/52323&whichpage=4Quote:
Let say there are 10 Bags of coins consisting of 3 different runs with a make up of 2A, 3B and 5C.
Blind folded you picked 1A, 1B, 1C and went about your project. You also WERE not given the make up of 10 the bags. Ergo, you gave A, B and C equal 33.33% weighting and started vaming.
Mathematically
A = 20%
B = 30%
C = 50% The point of the above is that your starting point is WRONG. One thing I would add here is - Scribbles. This darn thing cannot be viewed at 10X in most cases let alone to the naked eye. Yet they are listed. A person could go blind by doing this sort of vamming. What a bunch of bunk. I have an idea  - why don't some of you post the best Morgan - clashes / die breaks / Cuds / hot lips / scar face / NO phantom E please - you know that sort of thing without any regard to value or rarity just some nice interesting things going on where one can VISUALLY see the defect. This has to be your own / personal coin. (Russ had a clashed E - that type of stuff, not sure if he still has it) This could be an ongoing thing like the JFK roll hunting type of topic. Since we are trying to maintain a democratic process over here what do you think or is it just boring?  Thank you |
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Pillar of the Community
3660 Posts |
Well, I don't have any coins, so that lets me out. Might be interesting or fun for the rest of you all though.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3076 Posts |
let me just say this one time.......Vaming is NOT algerbraic....soirry I cant speel....it's not an equation....an equation is based upon definite known principles or numbers....by which unknown portions of the formula can be extrapolated with the equation......its not about 10% or any other means.....its what about, how many exist, and why...
though the minting process can guess/extrapolate how many of a given die produce.. it can not predict die failure at any given time or quantity...it can not predict when a failure will occur or how much longer in service it would be used past its "normal" life span...
It can not predict when the dies/pairs were changed......or even if a new OBV or RVS was introduced into the minting process........These are the studies of those who strive to understand vamming...
there is no infinite number......while the number of dies produced for the whole of the Morgan series is over 3,000 basic dies many years have less than 15.....not so infinite, yet, not entirely absolutely studied.......one must remember, some years have been EXTREMELY studied....and many have not......and there could be changes in the listings as time goes by or rather updates to the studies known so far.............Gene
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New Member
 United Kingdom
9 Posts |
Thanks Guys That has cleared that up, or has it?
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Pillar of the Community
3660 Posts |
Quote:
That has cleared that up, or has it? If it has, then you are a much smarter person than I am. The truth of the matter is that it will take a different breed of collector (than exists today) to put a whole new spin on many aspects of this hobby, before things are put into proper perspective. Today, recurring questions are being asked with a high degree of redundancy in answers. All answers seemingly revolve around the future, resting on the shoulders of those who just don't have the time to explore things right now, (but in reality, time is not the enemy, but ability is the obstacle, the great wall). The entire notion of VAM identification was modeled and carried out in a fashion inconsistent with the goal. Too much was bitten off, it couldn't be chewed, much less swallowed, and that is why this 'hobby' is in such a state of disarray today. Far too much emphasis is placed on die state designation in relationship to basic die pairings. You might say, 'well, these two things go hand in hand, and it is only natural to consider them both simultaneously'. True, but perspective has been lost with regard to priority, and the water has been muddied with the thirst for finding a speck on a coin that will give a new and unnecessary designation (the highly coveted 'discovery') to an already designated die pair. The 'hobby' is, in my opinion, not emerging from the unknown, but rather wallowing in quicksand, being sucked in and down by many factors and people that weaken it, and eat it away from the inside. |
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Pillar of the Community
3660 Posts |
Quote:
Vamming is NOT algebraic........it's not an equation. With the notable exception of myself, I believe the the rest of you guys are also members of the predominant VAM site. It seems rather ironic to me that I would have to be the one to say (to you of all people Gene), that you are wrong. Vamming had its roots as a hobby, and is still considered as such to those who post here, but to the silent majority, it is a business, an industry, not a hobby (although they would disagree vehemently for their own purpose of cover). Every VAM is an algebraic equation, and each equation contains the prefix of $$. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3076 Posts |
that is very true Zee, My meaning of equation is simply that it falls short of being an accurate assumption of vaming numbers supposedly within the system, if it did hold true IN ALL situations we wouldn't have the issue of VAM rarity....for most it is about the money, for some of us its about the hobby and the hunt.. |
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Pillar of the Community
3660 Posts |
Yeah Gene, I knew what you meant the first time. I just felt the need to be provocative and sarcastic. Thanks for not snapping back at my apparent foolishness.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3076 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
3660 Posts |
 You 'know' that is what makes it fun for me Gene, and I know that 'the hunt' is what makes it fun for you. I understand this, and respect it, more than you can probably imagine. For you, it is all about the coins and the learning, but for me it really is all about the folks. I like to mess with people, and I like it when they mess with me. In order for me to play the game though, I need to know a little bit about coins, so this is what I focus on, (I don't really need to 'own' coins to do that either). |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3076 Posts |
IF it were not for the interaction between people, it wouldnt be any fun at all,Getting to know the coins is one way we do that, and with some added spice(comments) thats what its all about.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
709 Posts |
The question shouldn't be how many vams are there? The question should be how many over hyped vams are there? Then the next question: how many misattributed vams are there?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3076 Posts |
IF someone really had nothing but time, you could just add up the surviving coins for the series and add them up, after all they are all vams, I think the "HYPE" is of critical concern.
The so called 'LISTS' were formed specifically in order to promote the hobby...Or was it conceived by design in order to cash in on what was already collected/hoarded, needing only the fish to swim by
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Pillar of the Community
3660 Posts |
Quote:
The question should be how many over hyped vams are there? I think that the answer to that one would closely correspond to current dealer stock (which is also dependent on refusal to update rarity ratings). All smoke and mirrors, we all know it, and there really isn't much point in complaining about. Vamming is a dealer's game. Collectors who seek the truth about certain things are viewed as revolutionary radicals. (Careful what you say)....... Vamming does not do this to itself, certain groups of people do it, and with the applause of all for making such 'significant contributions' to the hobby. I used to nearly vomit when I read such posts. I really don't think that I have missed out on anything worthwhile due to my personal boycott of visitation. Quote:
Then the next question: how many misattributed vams are there? That is totally dependent on those who accept the perceived superiority of one man's word (with finality) as law. Sheep and lemmings......there will be no individual thinking or words of descent. All wisdom and knowledge comes from one source. (This is not meant as a personal attack, but as a condemnation of the acceptance of such a system). |
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Pillar of the Community
3660 Posts |
Okay, I am finished with my expression of disgust on this topic. I would not like to be known as an instigator of any movement.
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Replies: 49 / Views: 7,485 |
First Page
Posted 09/10/2010 08:43 am
its all good, I too love to stir the pot abit
