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 Replies: 18 / Views: 5,693 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
891 Posts |
Hi all. In some MS grades I see that some hairlines are acceptable. Most people attribute hairlines to cleaning. If a coin is cleaned I don't consider it to mint state anymore. Are there other reasons for hairlines other than cleaning?
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Forum Mom
 United States
5877 Posts |
The planchets themselves are cleaned prior to striking. This can also leave hairlines but obviously these coins are not considered cleaned. I have seen some that looked like they were harshly cleaned but actually never were even wiped.
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Pillar of the Community
Belgium
2078 Posts |
Hairlines can be the result of cheap and crummy die polishing on business strikes Especially some South American gold coins are covered in die polishing lines In principle TPG's do not substract points for bad die polishin |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
one die polishing coin is a 1921 VAM-1A, it looks like it was cleaned with a brillo pad but it is actually from the dies being poorly polished. here is a picture of a VAM-1A  |
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Valued Member
United States
157 Posts |
Sometimes they can have hairlines if they were wiped, but not cleaned with any chemical and/or abrasive agent. Even a fine cloth can leave hairlines.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
like the picture I posted, it looks like it was cleaned with an abrasive product but like I said it was just because something the mint did to the dies that caused it and the TPG companies recognize this and grade them accordingly because it is not post mint damage |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7123 Posts |
Hairlines can be caused from the Mint cello also, the coins that were packaged in this cello have more room than necessisary and can slide from side to side.
Rick
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Pillar of the Community
United States
751 Posts |
Can hairlines be either depressed or raised? If they are caused by die polishing, then the die would be depressed and the coin would have a raised counterpart. I thought that's what hairlines were. Please correct if mistaken.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7123 Posts |
Hi Texas
Here is the definition of hairlines as supplied by PCGS
Fine cleaning lines found mainly in the fields of proof coins although they are sometimes found across the entire surface of proof coins and on Business strike coins.
This definition does not seem to include die polishing as a cause for hairlines.
Rick
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Valued Member
United States
157 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by MetalmanThis definition does not seem to include die polishing as a cause for hairlines.
Die polishing and hairlining are different things to collectors, though both can look the same with the naked eye and perhaps at low magnification. Die polish lines tend to be like "hairlines" in the die, which results in *raised* lines rather than incuse lines. With significant magnification, you can usually distinguish between hairlines and die polish lines based on whether or not the lines are raised above the surface level; if so it's probably die polish lines. In general die polish lines don't hurt the grade of the coin, though in extreme examples such a coin may be "net graded" downward. Hairlines caused by post-mint handling should generally reduce the grade of a mint state coin. |
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Pillar of the Community
Belgium
2078 Posts |
Bryan that is a beautifull picture In general if the lines are in the fields only and do not continue over the devices I will go with die polishing lines If the lines continue over the devices I am very cautious Also in general I will not buy a coin with diepolishing lines on it even if I know it will grade MS65 When I started on pure silver I took dust of a coin to scan it I used the shearest pure silk ponge 5 to do this The coin was ruined by hairlines  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
751 Posts |
Thank y'all for clearing this up for me.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
891 Posts |
Thanks for the answers. That helped out tremendously. So hairlines are acceptable as long as they are very minor and very few. And to not look as if they were from cleaning of any sort. I try not to buy coins with hairlines, but it does happen. Always thought that hairlines meant that it has been cleaned to some degree. Gives me a better understanding at what I'm looking at. Thanks all.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by ageka
Bryan that is a beautifull picture
In general if the lines are in the fields only and do not continue over the devices I will go with die polishing lines
If the lines continue over the devices I am very cautious
Also in general I will not buy a coin with diepolishing lines on it
even if I know it will grade MS65
When I started on pure silver I took dust of a coin to scan it
I used the shearest pure silk ponge 5 to do this
The coin was ruined by hairlines
I actually did'nt buy buy this coin, it was with a set I bought but it is a TOP100 coin and if I saw another I would probably buy it just because it is a TOP 100 VAM and when most people see them they think the coin was harshly cleaned and will not buy it |
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Pillar of the Community
Belgium
2078 Posts |
I have a visual problem here
to me whether the hairlines are from harsh cleaning or from bad polished dies they hurt my feelings of striving for perfection
I know the first is a boddybag and the second may be a MS65
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
well that is a problem when collecting VAM's none of them are perfect and thats what makes them the VAM. My grandfather used to keep only the "perfect" coins and he would examine each coin to make sure they were centered perfectly with a magnifying glass and if they werent he wouldn't keep them, now in his collection he has alot of perfect junk because everyone wants the errors and VAM's and well he spent all of them |
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Replies: 18 / Views: 5,693 |
Posted 08/14/2006 09:35 am
