Early Date Facing Eagle 8 Reales Of Mexico

Are you referring to "Hook-Neck" 8 reales minted from 1823-1824 or all the 8 reales minted with the eagle design (1824-1897 with a few exceptions) that are known as resplandores? I collect both types as do several others on this site.

Macro122!

I also collect 8R cap & rays "Resplandores" but I haven't acquired a hookneck yet or a Iturbide 8R which are on my "want" list.

Macro122 Hello again - interesting project. I recall another collector with the same objective. Your name isn't Roberto is it?

I also recall discussing this precise project with Dave O'Harrow who felt it was essentially impossible to complete a complete die listing after 1825. He felt there were too many dies for each year and that examples from all of the dies may no longer even exist.

How many die marriages do you have? Any counterfeits?

Welcome and Bienvenidos to CCF.

Hi Mike - I saw the name but still wondered if it was a pseudonym because Roberto has been focused on the same project for at least 10 years.

When I originally asked Dave O'Harrow about doing a die by die book like Hooknecks for Durango in the 1825 - 1826 range he indicated I could be hunting for in excess of 100 die pairs per year and that the number would rapidly increase to closer to 1000 pairs in 1832. He felt the task was too daunting for any one collector for an entire life's work. It was enough to derail me. But he did suggest going after the various punch combinations as a more reasonable target. How many different punches can be identified for the Durango eagles? The wings, body and head seem to be distinct punches in some cases so the question becomes were the various parts ever muled into different combinations? I know that the Internet and places like the forum are natural outlets for just this kind of interaction.

Remember when you think about the Bust half output of the US mint even in 1827 you are dealing with a very small production when compared to Mexican coins. Mexican mints produced MILLIONS of coins per year and these were later melted wholesale to retrieve gold from the alloy. So survival rates from the early years are often low - which is why they are not still dirt cheap. It is also why identifying more than a few dozen different dies may be difficult.

Perhaps you can be the catalyst necessary to locate in many different collections all of the known varieties. I have a few originals and would be happy to share what I do have with you.

But my real focus is on the counterfeit issues. There are dozens of Durango forgeries dated between 1825 and 1834. In fact the 1832 and 1834 Riddell dies # 365 and 371 (and their mules 365/371 and 371/365) are arguably the most common contemporary counterfeits in existence. The 365 eagle die totally lacks the crest on the eagle's head. This die was used with three cap dies dated 1832, 1834 and 1836. Many of these dies are very well made and it has been suspected that they were produced in France by the same people who supplied the real hubs. This suspicion was first published about 1840 so there may be some credence in the suspicion.

I will be happy to help in any way - perhaps we can involve Roberto as well.

Here are some scans for you. If you want higher resolution, just send me a PM with your email address and I will send you higher resolution. I will also look in my trays Republic 8's next time I am in the SDB and see if I have others. I actually collect Mo mint mark coins so I don't have the other mints very organized. I have no idea what else I have from Do

Hi Mike,

Welcome to the forums. I'm also a fellow collector of 8 Reales, however my focus is a little earlier (War of Independence). Still, I do enjoy nice pre-standardized die Resplandores.

Here's an early Durango I have for your viewing pleasures and for my own education:

Here are a couple early Durango counterfeits.