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Statistical Analysis Of Key And Semi-Key Lincoln Cents

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biggfredd's Avatar
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9104 Posts
 Posted 05/22/2011  2:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Back in the 70s, a rare geek with computer access came out with a monthly report on rolls of modern bu coins, where he calculated, using factors like mintages and years since issue, what rolls "should" sell for, and thus which ones were underpriced for investment.

It lasted a little over a year, but near the end, one of his commentaries pointed out that one date he felt was underpriced had risen to pretty close to his "should sell for" price.

He felt this proved his theories. Then again, if enough subscribers started looking for his underpriced issues, that alone could move the price up.
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drdave's Avatar
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 Posted 05/22/2011  5:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add drdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
biggfredd: I'm assuming that this was his only correct guess and that the rest were flops?
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biggfredd's Avatar
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 Posted 05/22/2011  7:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There were others that were getting close, but it was the only one at that point that got to its computed price.
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perfessor's Avatar
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 Posted 05/22/2011  10:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add perfessor to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
drdave: Thanks for the explanation. It makes more sense now. I guess we would all like to find the sleepers out there before they wake up and everyone wants them.
Since biggfredd mentioned the 1883 nickels and their obvious inverse prices, where do these fit in the Z values for Liberty nickels?
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delaner's Avatar
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870 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2011  5:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add delaner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This is interesting - the other things the anomalies can show are which varieties and mints are scarce for their grade, and those scarce despite their mintage. It could also give you a theoretical model for how many coins are circulating in different grades.

Pretty fun stuff!
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rdlem's Avatar
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187 Posts
 Posted 06/05/2011  4:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rdlem to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Awesome. Thanks drdave!
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ljenkins990's Avatar
United States
406 Posts
 Posted 06/09/2011  4:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ljenkins990 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Found a 1968-S looking through a few rolls of cents I picked up at the bank this afternoon
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sharpbfast's Avatar
United States
184 Posts
 Posted 07/22/2011  2:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sharpbfast to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Great research. I'm a math guy so I like this kind of stuff specially in subjects I'm interested in. I am still learning about the coin side but in one of your posts you have for example 2000 p1, 2001 p2 and so on. What is the P1, P2 or the D1 or D2 mean?

thanks
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Waredu's Avatar
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397 Posts
 Posted 07/22/2011  3:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Waredu to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In 2009, there were four different reverses on the Lincoln. The P and D refer to the Philadelphia and Denver mints, respectively.
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LastGold's Avatar
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228 Posts
 Posted 07/22/2011  3:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add LastGold to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
What I would like to see (with the Lincoln Memorial series), is a study of the relative rarity of mint state coins, (MS60 through MS70), for each year and mintmark, (with particular emphasis on the years 1983 through 1989).

I am a Lincoln Cent roll searcher (about 250,000 coins in so far), and I can tell you in my experience, for these years an MS64+ coin is about 100 or more times rarer than an MS63. It gets exponential, as an MS65 might be 1000 times rarer than the MS63 etc...

I know the grading services keep population reports. But they are generally associated with rarer coins. (the money it takes to get a coin graded for the vast majority of cents will be worth more than the cent itself).

I think the largest "sleeper" value in Lincoln cents is collecting them in very high grade states (especially the crossover years from copper to zinc) 1983 - 1989. They are just INCREDIBLY tough to find in even MS63!

Has anybody done a study on the relative rarity of Memorial cents (especially the zincs) in the various MS grades?





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biggfredd's Avatar
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 Posted 07/22/2011  7:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Has anybody done a study on the relative rarity of Memorial cents (especially the zincs) in the various MS grades?

As you mention, they're called population reports. Any dealer spending time (money) for such a study would likely keep the results forhis own profit. I wouldn't trust data from individuals, which is why we have tpgs, and they can't even hit a grade within $15,000.
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Hambone's Avatar
United States
609 Posts
 Posted 07/22/2011  7:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Hambone to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Man I must be doin good. In my box today I pulled two 74-S's. One is AU the other XF.

Only memorial I'm missing from 59-98 is the 73-S. I'm convinced that it eludes me.
Edited by Hambone
07/22/2011 7:39 pm
Bedrock of the Community
United States
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 Posted 07/22/2011  8:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks like a lot of really long research. Really nice work and lots of that. The main problem I see with such statistics is the really don't mean to much for availability. Anyone can say a 1931S Lincoln Cent had so many minted but no one on Earth knows how many are left. How many are in AU grades. How many are now part of a Copper bar. I once spent almost 2 years looking for a MS-64+ graded 1920D Lincoln Cent and just couldn't find one. Yet dealers kept telling me no problem, those are common. Yeah, right so where are they. Now same with a 33D in that grade. I've found 09S's, 09S VDB's and 14D's easier than many other so called COMMON dated coins.
Statistics on coinage is great for statistical information but without factual totals in existance, only statistics.
There was a post not long ago about all the things people did to coins. That one made me realize that is is amazing that any are left at all. And key dated coin of any denomination would greatly depend on how many exist. We could say a 1964 Jefferson nickel is worth a Nickel but if it was suddenly found that most were melted, then now is it a key?
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delaner's Avatar
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870 Posts
 Posted 07/25/2011  12:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add delaner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
But Carl, that's precisely the point of the work drdave is doing. If you analyze these numbers, you should be able to back-calculate current populations (IF the market forces are working correctly).

And yes, when you find that certain coins have higher melt rates than others, you find that their price is driven higher. That's what supply and demand does. That's why looking at these numbers is a fascinating look into the current coin market.

=)
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TrashyTrucker's Avatar
United States
7 Posts
 Posted 02/10/2012  12:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TrashyTrucker to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
WOW! Great information! I have been extremely interested lately in finding more stats on Lincoln Cents, with regard to where they have gone! I understand there was a penny melting ban from 1974-1978 or so, and wonder how that affected mintage figures both before and after the ban, and if people were in fact melting, what were they doing with the copper later? These questions (and many others!)actually occupy my driving time as a trucker! LOL :)

EDITED TO ADD: Dr. Dave, I'm too new to message you, is there a thread with the data you were/are working on for undervalued Lincoln Cents? Thanks for any reply! :)
Edited by TrashyTrucker
02/10/2012 1:11 pm
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