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Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
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The problem is that localised cleaning will show up where you have been working That is a very valid point, my friend, and I only disagree because what we're looking at here is active and will certainly become worse if left untouched. Yes, making it go away will be a visible scar. It's active verdigris. Especially if done right, which is to say, only addressing the specific problem and not the whole coin. The alternative, in my mind, is worse. This is a coin of relative importance - pre-1864 IHC's will have importance going forward - and it deserves enough attention to survive both of us for future collectors. |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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The problem is that localised cleaning will show up where you have been working Couldnt you avoid that problem with a full coin dip or just doing the whole coin? |
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
Quote:
Couldnt you avoid that problem with a full coin dip or just doing the whole coin? No. I'm guessing you're not using the term "dip" in the silver, thiourea sense, but rather in the sense of using Verdicare or similar, which is intended to be used that way as well. The "dip" will only affect the area where verdigris is active; the rest of the coin will remain untouched. Unfortunately, what's left under that verdigris is going to look different from the rest of the coin. That's already an unchangeable reality. The only thing left possible is to minimize the long-term damage. Aside: If you're going to use a "tool" on the infection - recommended in this case, if you can adhere to strict procedure - use a rose thorn. They are incomprehensibly sharp, while also too soft to scratch the coin. |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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No. I'm guessing you're not using the term "dip" in the silver, thiourea sense, but rather in the sense of using Verdicare or similar, which is intended to be used that way as well. The "dip" will only affect the area where verdigris is active; the rest of the coin will remain untouched. Unfortunately, what's left under that verdigris is going to look different from the rest of the coin. That's already an unchangeable reality. The only thing left possible is to minimize the long-term damage. Thats very interesting to know. I was using the term more of a submerging the coin like you assumed. I've never used verdicare my self as so far I've been fortunate to avoid the verdigras problem (knock on wood) I just know a lot of members are very fond of the product. I think I was assuming it was more like acetone than a specific spot cleaner for lack of a better term. I do agree 100% even knowing itll give it a different look its 100 percent better to stop the problem and have that look than let it continue to spread and ruin the coin more |
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21788 Posts |
The green pimple is mostly a verdigris problem, but not entirely.
The salts of nickel as well as those of copper, are green.
The alloy is of copper nickel and should be more chemically stable, but is still clearly sensitive to localised verdigris attack, as the picture clearly shows.
BTW, I have not seen much written regarding the preservation of ancient bronze coins, using Verdicare. Why is that?
Long term soaking of ancient bronze coins in olive oil IS popular, but that treatment tends to darken or even blacken ancient bronzes. Verdicare when used on U.S. bronze coins seems to be much better in this regard.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4085 Posts |
I have had really great results with the Verdicare on situations like the 1860 Indian. Yes, you will likely see a difference in toning where the verdigris was, but it will be a major major improvement as well as preserving the coin against future damage.
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
Quote:
BTW, I have not seen much written regarding the preservation of ancient bronze coins, using Verdicare. Why is that?
Long term soaking of ancient bronze coins in olive oil IS popular, but that treatment tends to darken or even blacken ancient bronzes. Verdicare when used on U.S. bronze coins seems to be much better in this regard.
VerdiGone (the first generation) and VerdiCare are pretty new products. They're quite popular here because BadThad shared their development here at CCF, posting his development progress and imaged results in the forum. We've been in since the ground floor, for that reason. It's been too short of a time for really widespread results, especially with the relatively-small proportion of Ancients collectors. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
19966 Posts |
The V coin could very well have PVC damage. I would first try soaking in acetone for 24 hours (sealed container) to make sure that there's no plasticizer residue. After that, I would soak it in VC for 24 hours and then use the toothpick method (outlined in the VERDI-CARE™ FAQ). Nickel verdigris is VERY tough because it's composed of both copper AND nickel salts. The nickel salts are much more difficult to remove but light to moderate levels can be addressed with some work. I would spot treat the IHC. Simply apply a tiny drop of VC to cover the spot. Let it stand for around 5-10 minutes then use the toothpick method. If needed, you can repeat a few times, but it anything remains after 3 tries, I'd leave it. It's usually not a good idea to remove heavy verdigris because the surface underneath will be pitted. VC will stop the active corrosion process - DO NOT RINSE after treatment, simply dab off the excess VC and let it dry at least 24 hours after conservation. If anyone ever wants to buy VC, they can send me a PM. I offer a discount to CC forum members. Lincoln Cent Lover!VERDI-CARE� INVENTOR https://verdi.care/
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1721 Posts |
BadThad, or as you were called in the begining of the thread, BadThud  , I missed the discount coupon. That's OK, in this economy we can all use the extra green. I've got the nickel soaking acetone. I think the vertipoop will be a bear to remove  . When I get the Verticare I'll try that too. I will post before and after picks in the future. Before=  After=  I hope! BadThad or anyone else every send a coin to PCGS (or other service) after an acetone bath? If so, what were the results? I would also assume any rubbing on the coin would be bad. This includes old toothbrushes or Q-Tip swirling. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
620 Posts |
Verdi care will work wonders on your coins
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Moderator
United States
189340 Posts |
 I know this from experience.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
526 Posts |
Quote:The V coin could very well have PVC damage. I would first try soaking in acetone for 24 hours (sealed container) to make sure that there's no plasticizer residue. After that, I would soak it in VC for 24 hours and then use the toothpick method (outlined in the VERDI-CARE™ FAQ). Nickel verdigris is VERY tough because it's composed of both copper AND nickel salts. The nickel salts are much more difficult to remove but light to moderate levels can be addressed with some work. I would spot treat the IHC. Simply apply a tiny drop of VC to cover the spot. Let it stand for around 5-10 minutes then use the toothpick method. If needed, you can repeat a few times, but it anything remains after 3 tries, I'd leave it. It's usually not a good idea to remove heavy verdigris because the surface underneath will be pitted. VC will stop the active corrosion process - DO NOT RINSE after treatment, simply dab off the excess VC and let it dry at least 24 hours after conservation. If anyone ever wants to buy VC, they can send me a PM. I offer a discount to CC forum members. I had the same exact problem with a "V" nickel about a year or so ago. I had to soak it in Acetone for almost three days changing the acetone and rinsing with fresh acetone. I then proceeded to place the "V" nickel on a "Microfiber" towel and cover the coin with Verdicare to where it pooled up on the coin. Let coin set for a day or so making sure that the surface was completely covered but never dried out. I then used the "Microfiber" towel to clean up the remaining Verdicare on the face of the coin by gently turning the coin in small circles without touching the coin itself. After making sure both sides were spot free (Took two weeks of doing this with Verdicare) I then soaked it in Acetone for about an hour and then rinsed with Fresh Acetone and distilled water, Patted the coin dry, let it air dry some more and then placed it in a flip. The verdigis did some minute damage to the coin but it was rescued to the point where it looked real nice. The coin is locked up in my SDB or I would post a couple of pictures of it. Trust BadThad's advice, it does work it just takes time. Edited by Freedom
10/22/2012 12:27 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1721 Posts |
I've had the V-Nickel soaking in acetone for almost 2 days and there is not much of a visible difference (if any at all). I just received my Verdicare (thanks for the fast shipping BadThad) and I'll get it soaking tonight. I'll keep you guys posted with my results.
PS acetone sounds like something an aerobics instructor does for you.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
8518 Posts |
I love love love these types of threads concerning conserving coins. I was gonna ask SuperDave if that was PVC damage on the V nickel but Thad answered that one. Mds308 thanks for posting and I sure wanna see some after pics. I love CCF ! Oregon coin geek.....*** GO BEAVS ! ! ! ***
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Moderator
United States
189340 Posts |
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Replies: 21 / Views: 2,988 |
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Posted 10/19/2012 9:41 pm
