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Bronze Disease - Need Help

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 Posted 01/21/2017  12:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add lrbguy to your friends list
Your coin has bronze disease, not verdigris. Removing the green chemical salts and sealing the areas will only make matters worse. Here is why: once BD starts it sustains itself within the fabric of the coin. Sealing it from air and moisture does not stop the action which continues beneath the sealant. But the sealant does hinder your ability to treat the coin chemically.

The treatment which will stop the progress of bronze disease involves the use of sodium sesquicarbonate and a specific set of procedures for applying it and removing it. Unfortunately this treatment will also destroy some patina. The treatment is not worse than the disease when the BD is in its later stages and is forming pits. That is what it is doing to your coin.

the green deposits are the result of chemical action between the bronze and HCL

BTW- don't let this coin or the material on it make contact with other bronze coins in your collection. True BD is "contagious."
Edited by lrbguy
01/21/2017 12:51 pm
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 Posted 01/21/2017  12:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Baltas to your friends list
Thank you all of you!
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 Posted 01/21/2017  1:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kamnaskires to your friends list
Here's the site I usually refer folks to for bronze disease treatment info: http://kevinscoins.ancients.info/BD...Disease.html
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 Posted 01/21/2017  1:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Baltas to your friends list
Thank you!
Now I go and buy the ingredients. :)
I will post pictures when I will finish the process.
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 Posted 01/21/2017  3:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list
Before you go and buy chemicals you may want to try this. I've done this and it halted the progression of the disease. Place the coin in a 200 degree oven or under a lamp that will heat the coin to remove the moisture trapped in it. Once the coin is heated remove it quickly and place it under and air tight jar so the moisture does seep back into the coin as it cools. Once cooled you can remove what remains on the green deposits. Than you can give the coin a coat of REN wax. Simple but it works.
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 Posted 01/21/2017  9:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chrsmat71 to your friends list
That's what I used to do, but be careful using wax! I had BD on this coin, treated it with distilled water/baking soda, scrubbed, then baked it (didn't use the air tight jar however). looked good, then applied some wax, here it is a few months later...

Bronze-Disease---Need-Help

As lrbguy said... the BD just kept going under the wax.


I treated again with distilled water, baked to dry, then treated with verdi-care, then it look like this...

Bronze-Disease---Need-Help

It still looks like that two years later. I just checked it again. Dont' forget to cheep checking your coin, that stuff tends to come back!
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 Posted 02/19/2017  8:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Baltas to your friends list
Thank you all of you!

I did both process twice! :D Just for sure, but I did not cover with wax.
The coin is still in quarantine, but looks ok!



Bronze-Disease---Need-Help
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 Posted 02/19/2017  8:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kamnaskires to your friends list
Wow! Great job. Does the reverse look this good?
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 Posted 02/19/2017  8:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list
I agree you did an excellent job.
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 Posted 02/19/2017  9:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list
nice job @baltas!
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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 Posted 02/20/2017  12:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Baltas to your friends list
Thank you!

Both side better in hand. Still some brownish patina remain.
I made a small trick. After I finished cleaning there were holes, where the metal was shiny. So I dripping liver of sulfur, to earn that darker area.


Bronze-Disease---Need-Help

(If I am right the coin is "healthy" now, because I put water into the holes around a week ago, and nothing bad happend.)
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 Posted 02/20/2017  11:07 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add lrbguy to your friends list
Baltas, this is an excellent result. I am not familiar with "liver of sulfur" but it might just be interfering with the bonding of the chloride, substituting a sulphate or sulphide or sulphite ion. The chemistry is hairy (for me), but it looks good if this works. I prefer this to the use of carbonates. Can we see it 6 months from now? I still wouldn't wax it just yet, but if it's clean for a few months, then maybe.
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 Posted 02/20/2017  11:25 am  Show Profile   Check Victor's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Victor to your friends list
"this is an excellent result. I am not familiar with "liver of sulfur" but it might just be interfering with the bonding of the chloride, substituting a sulphate or sulphide or sulphite ion."


He only used the liver of sulfur to darken the shiny bits, not treat the bronze dise ASE
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 Posted 02/20/2017  11:34 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add lrbguy to your friends list

Quote:
liver of sulfur to darken the shiny bits,



It helps to know what this stuff is and how it is used. As I said, I'm not familiar with it. What is it?
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 Posted 02/20/2017  1:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Baltas to your friends list
Yes, I used that stuff only for coloring the naked parts.

Wikipedia:
"Liver of Sulfur is a poorly defined mixture of potassium sulfide, potassium polysulfide, potassium thiosulfate, and probably potassium bisulfide. Synonyms include hepar sulfuris, sulfur, sulfurated potash and sulfurated potassa.
Liver of sulfur is mainly used in metalworking to form a patina, turning copper alloys brown or black.
Typically liver of sulfur comes in a dry rock form which must be broken into smaller pieces and dissolved in hot water for use."

I do not like the color of this patina, but perfect if you want to correct small surfaces.
Of course I will post new pics a few months later.
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