1909 VDB Lincoln Wheat Cent - Unlisted Retained Cud - MS

Die crack, not a Retained Cud. Although a lot of people will call it one.

Isn't a Retained Cud, where part of the die is missing, and the planchet gets struck anyhow, and that leaves a raised portion where the missing part of the die was ?
What I see, is a die crack, a Cud appears after that cracked portion of the die breaks away and a planchet gets struck ?

Dan

Read the description closer. It takes vertical displacement and or horizontal offset to qualify. Thanks, Doug.

http://www.error-ref.com/?s=Retaine...ontal+offset

Definite Retained Cud. You can see the displacement of the metal. Nice find.

Tropicalbats, new listing!

Coop, "Note the die is moving on the retained area. But had not broken off the die yet" seems to describes a pre-cud.

http://www.error-ref.com/die_crack_...__pre-cud__/

I'm still on fence that it is or is not fully detached at this point. If not, I have no doubt (if die was left in production) the section showing some lateral spread would've fully detached itself. If not this strike, then soon there after. Thanks, Doug.

Pretty straightforward on the photos, but I spent some time going through different bulbs and lighting angles before settling on that end. For the full coin shots I use a Canon S95 pocket point-and-shoot camera. It's an older somewhat high end thing that can now be bought for about $50. The light is an unfrosted 75W GE 1490 Lumen halogen placed about 12 inches above and slightly behind the stage. I take the photos with the camera tilted about 5 degrees off to get the light to cover the coin with minimal washout/shadow issues.

The macros are with an AmScope trinocular stereoscope, although more often than not I just point an iPhone down the lens rather than use the onboard camera. The light on the scope is a halogen with a diffusion ring set in the original mount on the scope. The scope can be bought with this light installed. The scope I use is actually for my biology work and has a backlit stage and all the trimmings, but a much less expensive one works just fine.

Coop, I agree. Fist, there is pretty clear movement at both rim contacts and both spots on the wheat where it hits. With shifting at all four of those locations it is a pretty solid call as a Retained Cud. Second, yes it seems a very nice die to be breaking, but such has been my experience. That is, that the die age is not strongly correlated to Cud formation. A lot of Cuds are on pretty young dies and a lot of very old dies have no Cuds.

Totally understandable to accept only those coins with a no question qualifier. The tough part for the attributor would be disqualifying another coin because there is no way to know if it is or isn't a listable die event.
Ultimately it is up to the individual collector as to what guidelines he or she personally follows