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Calling Exoguy... Counterstamped Morgan

 
 
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Pillar of the Community
United States
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 Posted 02/21/2017  7:45 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Cascade to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Whatcha think Exo. What kind of premium here? The name fits an inventor of the period on a brief Google search. I know it's not a well known C/S or business etc but it's a full name and on a Morgan. I've only run across a couple of counterstamp Morgans in the past and they all sold or were asking for big bucks



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 Posted 02/21/2017  10:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MikeF to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I came across one of those on a Barber half. If memory serves it was coin a member of this community listed for sale. I had no idea these fetch larger premiums.
Hi, my name is MikeF and I'm a degenerate coin collector. I also like adventure, big trucks, long walks on the beach and the Kansas City Chiefs.
Pillar of the Community
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 Posted 02/21/2017  11:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
They do. Especially on Morgans. However, while an identifiable full name is good and the fact that it can be traced and he's an inventor adds more than an anonymous name, the big money comes with famous businesses and such but with Morgans even just a full generic name carries more weight than if it were on any other series. I'm no expert though but exoguy is whenever he stops by.
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 Posted 02/22/2017  10:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Cascade .... Just spotted your summons!

Yes, the counterstamped Morgans do tend to garner strong interest as a series, in general. That said, the early Bust coins, those bearing attributable counterstamps, tend to be the cream of the crop.

Personally, I prefer the pre-1880 counterstamps, merchant issues as opposed to the one-of-a-kind, unique pieces. The earlier counterstamps tend to be easier to attribute, I've found. Just like coins in general, there are many ways that folks collect counterstamps. With regard to the Morgans, I suspect that there are a few collectors out there who are laboring to assemble date/year sets of counterstamps .... no easy task!

I do find the subject piece, stamped JOHN C. DEWYELL, to be interesting, simply given the most uncommon surname. Sadly, there's no town, address, occupation or other info given that would contribute to a slam-dunk attribution. I would say that there's a strong likelihood it's a guy from Livonia, NY who patented a "Circular Buttress" with a cutting knife in 1890, which see:

https://books.google.com/books?id=L...l%22&f=false

IMHO, this piece could fetch $100 or so at auction, being somewhere between $50-$150. Attaching the patent info and any historical info on the probable issuer always helps.

This counterstamp is as yet unlisted by Brunk, but that fact neither contributes to or detracts from its real value. There's a general perception among collectors that unlisted pieces, those not as yet in the census, are worth more. Perception sometimes drives prices up. Truth be known, probably well under half the counterstamps extant remain as yet unlisted.

There's a strong possibility that the subject piece is unique and likely was John's pocket piece. Many inventors, machinists and the like, were masons and/or members of other fraternal organizations. It was customary for them to carry a pocket piece, bearing their mark, to show to brothers as an ID; this, similar to the use of masonic cents a.k.a. chapter pennies.

Aside from finding a second counterstamp, one with more information stamped thereon, there is another way to make a positive attribution on this piece. Find a cutting knife or other patented item, bearing a matching name stamp. I've managed to occasionally do that in my research. This is a great part of the fun, I find, piecing things together, making connections, solving puzzles ....
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 Posted 02/22/2017  11:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks exo. I left out early bust half's as they're in a league all their own. There are guys compiling date sets of counterstamped Morgans? Is that even possible lol. Good idea on trying to match the font and block on this to maybe his invention if that's possible. Still a neat "middle of the road" piece. Much better than just initials or a generic name
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 Posted 02/22/2017  10:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MikeF to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Reminds me of this flowing hair dollar I was watching during the fun show. I ended up buying a different one but I really liked the look of this coin. I tried googling around for the guys name but came up empty. Needless to say it didn't sell for a premium.
https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-doll...mpLot-081514
Hi, my name is MikeF and I'm a degenerate coin collector. I also like adventure, big trucks, long walks on the beach and the Kansas City Chiefs.
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 Posted 02/22/2017  10:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Graffiti and counterstamps are two totally different realms. You wouldn't think so but
Pillar of the Community
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3530 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2017  11:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Good idea on trying to match the font and block on this to maybe his invention if that's possible.


It's a rare occurrence, but it can be done. Years ago, I acquired the below counterstamp, hosted on an 1854 half dollar ....



A few years later, I found this ....





Geo. Geer of Meriden, Connecticut patented the above cherry pitter in 1867. In 1874, George patented a boot jack. To date, this is the only specimen of which I'm aware. Like the subject piece in this thread, it's a single name and as yet unlisted by Brunk. The matching patent name is not an exact match by size, but the use of GEO. for George much suggests it's the same guy who stamped the coin. Consider this could be the same counterstamp that George used on his boot jack ... if only I can find one of those!

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 Posted 02/23/2017  12:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very cool. The blueprint is the closest I could find so far...

New Member
United States
1 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2018  8:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add WhiteCoyote45 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Cascade,

I have an 1800's knife with the name "John C. Dewyell" struck into the blade in the same font as your struck Morgan coin. I bought the knife in an antique store not far from Lavonia, NY. I tried for a LONG while to upload a photo, but this forum is the most complicated of any I've seen and couldn't get it to post. Please feel free to contact me by email and I will share photos with you.
Pillar of the Community
United States
3530 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2018  9:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
to the CCF, WhiteCoyote45.

With patience, the image posts can be achieved. After all, I've done it!

A great many cutlers, makers of knives, surgical instruments, swords and the like, counterstamped coins. I have, on many occasions, found the matching marks on cutler products. Here's one ....





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13117 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2018  9:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I tried for a LONG while to upload a photo


@WC45, sorry that you are having trouble uploading photos. Here is a link to the tutorial:

https://www.coincommunity.com/forum...g-images.asp
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
Valued Member
United States
104 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2018  12:07 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Narrowback44 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
ExoGuy Any help please? Found him on this list but couldn't find anything else. Unless he's French...
http://www.exonumia.com/art/cma.htm



Thanks
Edited by Narrowback44
04/17/2018 12:12 am
Pillar of the Community
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3530 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2018  05:47 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@Narrowback44 .... Whenever posting images of counterstamped coins, it's best to orient the image according to the stamp and not the coin. This enables the viewer to better read the stamp. Here's a corrected image ...





This J. CARLTON couunterstamp is clearly doubly stamped. Brunk listed this maverick in 2003, catalog # C-196, with then three specimens reported. All were large cents, with the latest date being 1853.

A cursory search of early directories reveals that this surname is quite common. The singular initial "J" (also common) adds to the difficulty of attributing this counterstamp. Uncommon surnames, preceded by multiple initials or first names are much easier to peg. That said, occasionally, a previously unidentified counterstamp, bearing clues like an address, occupation or town will surface, and attribution can then be accomplished.

Here's a case on point ....

The W.H.A. counterstamp on the below Spanish two real piece, bearing but simple initials, appears to be a maverick that would likely never stand a chance of being attributed.



Along comes the below large cent with not only a matching W.H.A. counterstamp but an additional mark that reads W.H. ATKINS.



This W.H. ATKINS counterstamp was attributed by Dave Bowers. William H. Atkins of Ithaca, NY patented a perpetual calendar clock in 1854. He and partner, J.C. Burritt, figured a way for their clock to automatically adjust for leap year. Atkins stamped numerous coins, many of which bear the simple initials.




Edited by ExoGuy
04/17/2018 05:48 am
Valued Member
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104 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2018  2:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Narrowback44 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks so much.
Sorry about the alignment, makes sense.

Pillar of the Community
United States
3530 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2018  6:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Thanks so much.
Sorry about the alignment, makes sense.


Always happy to assist a fellow CCF member when I can. Sadly, I couldn't peg your maverick. I run into the alignment issue, constantly. I took the time to expand on that as other readers of this thread may benefit. Many eBay sellers make the same mistake, and it often costs them in sales. I've managed to buy a few great counterstamps super-cheap when sellers use a pic of the non-stamped side of the coin first.
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