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Carolingian? Coin To Identify

 
 
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Netherlands
34 Posts
 Posted 11/13/2019  3:22 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add vstefanyuk to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Hi!

Need a help with identifying coin which, most possible, is Carolingian.
I looked though the list of thousands coins from multiple sources but still can't identify it.

Please, see attached photo. Could not provide better quality for now.

Thanks!

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 Posted 11/13/2019  5:09 pm  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
vstefanyuk;

Glad you made your way over here! I just lightened up the photos a bit.



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Netherlands
34 Posts
 Posted 11/13/2019  5:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add vstefanyuk to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thx!

Btw, I went through http://numismatics.org/digitallibra...5/nnan105846 and didn't similar as well. Closest to legend on reverse (temple side) I see:

1611. Obv.: +RADVLDVSREX. Cross.

Rev.:+ANITOCIIVIT. Karolus (?) monogram. Denarius. Prou 772; Gariel LIV, 26 (Gariel Coll.)..

Gariel Coll., 1259; Meyer Coll., 434.

Paris: 1.20 gr.; Berlin: (Plate XLVII); ANS: 1.22 gr.

ANGOULéME

But, probably, it is still not the one.
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 Posted 11/13/2019  10:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You've already done a lot of research ...

On temple side I am seeing + RAD?SDICONA. I had thought something like RATISBON for Regensburg, but maybe there were no temple denars issued there?

On the other side, that does not look like any CAROLVS monogram I have seen, but you have probably seen far more than I have.
Edited by tdziemia
11/13/2019 10:28 pm
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 Posted 11/13/2019  10:29 pm  Show Profile   Check echizento's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
to the community

Interesting coin, I have a copy of Medieval Silver Coins of Medieval France and have not been able to find a match for this one.
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 Posted 11/13/2019  10:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kushanshah to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
+RADASDICONA is indeed Regensburg/ Ratisbon. A Google search of that spelling brought up the page below from Munzstudien by Hermann Grote, Vol. 8, 1877, p. 210. The obverse center names the future emperor Henry III as King of Germany. Henry was the eldest son and heir of the Holy Roman Emperor Conrad II who is named in the obverse margin. The dynasty is known as the "Salian".
Edited by Kushanshah
11/13/2019 11:09 pm
New Member
Netherlands
34 Posts
 Posted 11/14/2019  04:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add vstefanyuk to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@Kushanshah Thank you very much! No doubts it would take me ages (or never) to identify this coin by myself.

Trying to find similar coins. So far found these https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=s...287&cid=8654 and this one seems to be the closest one https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=l...287&lot=3348, but no exact match.
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 Posted 11/14/2019  06:03 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Certainly looks like Type 51 in the link from @kushanshah, with the monogram arranged in a circle (we can see letters H (12:00) X (3:00) C (6:00 on its side) maybe S (on its side 7:00) R (9:00). First half of legend on this side looks like CHVON or CHUOII. There is also a D at 9:00.

Reverse is either 496, or maybe better 500 in his link.

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Netherlands
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 Posted 11/14/2019  06:23 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add vstefanyuk to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@tdziemia Thx! Hope I will have better pictures soon to check it.
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 Posted 11/15/2019  10:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@kushanshah, is there another obverse type in that reference?

Here is what I am seeing for the monogram, similar to Type 51 in the reference, with 90 degree clockwise rotation, but some differences in which letters and their positions. So, E H N at 10:00 to 2:00 (instead of N E H in the reference), R X at 9:00 and 3:00 (same), S C H (or N) at 8:00 to 4:00 (instead of I C R in the reference).


By the way, very neat coin!
Edited by tdziemia
11/15/2019 11:01 am
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 Posted 11/18/2019  10:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kushanshah to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@tdziemia I read the central inscription (in a semi-literate early medieval sort of way) as [H?] E N R S R E X or perhaps [H?] E N R CI R E X. I think the letters that look like H are actually E without the middle arm and the letter that looks like E is actually intended as N (base outward). Note also that your C has "legs" and is in the spot where R is expected.

I didn't save a link but but there should be enough info in my previous post to find the reference in Google Books. As I recall, I originally googled the word RADASDICONA and that page popped right up complete with highlight.
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Netherlands
34 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2019  03:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add vstefanyuk to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Btw, there is another coin from the same seller. It is possible it was found by the same digger along with first coin.

This coin also looks unusual. Look at left/right side of the temple.




Was not able to find it as well.
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 Posted 11/20/2019  07:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If German, like the other, my first impression is this is from Otto era, late 10th, early 11th century (maytbe you already discovered this in your search).
These often have letters O D D O or variant in the angles between the cross, but yours just looks like pellets.

Hopefully that crozier to the left will help with a positive ID. Would seem to indicate an issue by a bishop, i.e. from someplace like Regensburg again, Cologne, Mainz, Speyer, etc.

Here is something similar from Erfurt: https://wcn.pl/archive/168316?q=Nie...denar&page=5

The desription from the auction house just says "Chapel with cross inside and letters at sides," but I think the symbol to the left could be a crozier as on yours?

Edited by tdziemia
11/20/2019 08:10 am
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Netherlands
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 Posted 11/20/2019  08:41 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add vstefanyuk to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@tdziemia Yes! Very likely the same coin. Thank you very much!
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