Coin Community Family of Web Sites
Like us on Facebook! Subscribe to our Youtube Channel! Check out our Twitter! Check out our Pinterest!
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

Welcome Guest! Need help? Got a question? Inherit some coins?
Our coin forum is completely free! Register Now!

1736 8 Reales Pillar

Next Page | Last 15 Replies
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 21 / Views: 1,275Next Topic
Page: of 2
New Member

France
3 Posts
 Posted 03/08/2020  2:32 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add dies to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Hi all!
I'm new member, my name is Fabrizio and writing from Germany.
I'm very grateful to everyone expert on this coin who can confirm authenticity of this coin.

weight is 26,82 grams

Thanks!
Regards





Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
United States
1043 Posts
 Posted 03/08/2020  6:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jgenn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
No, that does not look genuine. Some obvious problems: the edge is not correct and appears to have been completely overlapped; oddly shaped denticles with way too much space between them.
New Member
France
3 Posts
 Posted 03/09/2020  06:02 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dies to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@jgenn thank you for you information
Moderator
Learn More...
United States
86522 Posts
Pillar of the Community
United States
4965 Posts
 Posted 03/14/2020  2:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add swamperbob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
dies

I agree with jgenn that the coin can not be authentic, I would add to that it is almost without a doubt a relatively modern Numismatic Forgery and not a highly collectable "Contemporary Circulating Counterfeit".

I was wondering how you acquired the coin and if possible from whom? I am a collector and researcher of fake Mexican 8 Reales and I have an interest in both period and modern fakes.

The edge design used is what I am specifically interested in.

If you ever want to sell this please post a comment here and I will get in touch with you.

swamperbob - Robert Gurney North Carolina, USA
My book on Counterfeit Portrait 8Rs is available from Amazon http://ccfgo.com/TheUnrealReales or from me directly if you want it signed.
New Member
France
3 Posts
 Posted 03/14/2020  3:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dies to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi swamperbob and thanks a lot for your comment too.

I bought from ebay. Seller was from greece, and I have already shipped back to him, because payed a lot (336).

Seller insists that is authentic 100%, but I opened paypal invoce to be refunfed.

Thanks for your interest and kindly confimation.

Ciao!
Pillar of the Community
United States
1509 Posts
 Posted 04/02/2020  12:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add realeswatcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I put this in the "get back to" column... Have now gotten back to it :->

Had a hunch about where these were from... some digging proved that out. This piece in question from eBay:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/8-Reales-M...133336308343

This piece, as suspected, came from Schulman in the Netherlands (the old family firm that the famous/infamous Hans Schulman was part of originally before coming to America):
https://www.biddr.com/auctions/schu...563&l=576627

He currently has listed:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/8-Reales-M...133373989774

which was:
https://www.biddr.com/auctions/schu...563&l=576630

And, on Catawiki:
https://www.catawiki.com/l/35300021...ipe-v-silver

which was:
https://www.biddr.com/auctions/schu...563&l=576625

Schulman, in multiple auctions over the past 3-4 years or so, has auctioned off a large chunk of ROOSWIJK shipwreck finds - mostly pillars, plus some Klippes and a few cobs.

Note that he finished the "conservation" (cleaning) job on these pieces... I can personally attest that these were done a bit sloppily (abrasively cleaned leading to notable hairlining, more uneven tone remaining than pics showed, etc.).

PS - if that edge design presentation (with what seems to be an exaggeratedly long segment of overlap or doubling, whatever it is) looks all that damming... you haven't looked at enough early pillars in hand. This feature is NOT that out of the ordinary on such pieces. There are TONS of these 1730s-early 1740s pilalrs floating around out there from the Big 3 wreck sources (Hollandia, Rooswijk, Reijgersdaal) - go to Baltimore or an ANA or similar (if the world doesn't end) and play with some in hand.
Edited by realeswatcher
04/02/2020 01:09 am
Pillar of the Community
United States
1509 Posts
 Posted 04/02/2020  01:11 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add realeswatcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
FYI, one nice thing... the seller has a bunch of rather clear edge pics on all of his listings. Save and study :->
Pillar of the Community
United States
1509 Posts
 Posted 04/10/2020  08:03 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add realeswatcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
A nice klippe from Schulman's most recent Rooswijk batch back in October. Haven't been on top of my auction game lately - would have bid on this one as it's a great large planchet strike:
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
United States
3391 Posts
 Posted 04/10/2020  08:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very nice research. Just did my first business with Schulman recently (but I stay far away from Spanish colonials
Valued Member
358 Posts
 Posted 04/10/2020  08:54 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Numister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Would the small holes be indicative of casting marks ?
Pillar of the Community
United States
1509 Posts
 Posted 04/12/2020  04:11 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add realeswatcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
"Would the small holes be indicative of casting marks?"

Read through the entire thread...
Valued Member
United States
91 Posts
 Posted 04/19/2020  2:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add afewmorecents to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So, if I'm reading this correctly, the OP's coin is a counterfeit and the Schulman pieces are genuine? It looks like the OP's coin has the same reverse as one linked to the auction. the castles match and I see a tiny round pimple on the outer edge of the shield across from the top of the "8." I'm not able to print the images so I can compare them better.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1509 Posts
 Posted 04/20/2020  3:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add realeswatcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The piece the OP posted (which he bought on eBay, then returned) was Lot 184 from the May 2019 Schulman auction, as I linked.
Valued Member
United States
91 Posts
 Posted 04/21/2020  10:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add afewmorecents to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks. I'm a little slow so that means the OP's coin is genuine in spite of some opinions here.
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
United States
1043 Posts
 Posted 04/21/2020  12:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jgenn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In general, nobody can authenticate a coin from photographs. The best we can do is point out obvious inconsistencies with what we understand to be the genuine appearance.

Based on the eBay edge photos of the OP coin that realeswatcher kindly linked, I would only believe the edge to have been done on a parallel edging device if the blank was processed twice. Not impossible but certainly not the normal process.

That being said, I would offer the opinion that the OP coin and other linked coin are "market acceptable", meaning that most if not all dealers would sell or auction them without hesitation. That is not the same as declaring them to be genuine; dealers are not in the business of authenticating coins.
Edited by jgenn
04/21/2020 12:54 pm
Page: of 2 Previous TopicReplies: 21 / Views: 1,275Next Topic  
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.

Coin Community Member eBay Sales

Certified Coins   Certified VAMs   Certified Errors  




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2020 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2020 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.65 seconds to rattle this change. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.05