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Did The TPG Drop The Ball With This "1875 PCGS PR62 20c Twenty Cent?"

 
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Author Previous TopicReplies: 14 / Views: 675Next Topic  
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 Posted 10/19/2020  12:33 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add daltonista to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Take a look at eBay item number: 203142577526. I'm not a potential buyer, but the listing title caught my eye. What's going on where the mintmark normally shows on the reverse? And what about "details" for the scratches? (I confess my ignorance: maybe that's acceptable die polishing or some other kind of "normal" for a U.S. silver proof of this vintage?)

Just mildly shocked...
Tom



"I ain't good-looking, but I'm willing to try."
--- Dave "Snaker" Ray: 'It's All Right,' 1963
Edited by daltonista
10/19/2020 1:14 pm
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 Posted 10/19/2020  1:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add IndianGoldEagle to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I just can't see this coin in a straight grade holder. Obvious signs of a rough cleaning.
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 Posted 10/19/2020  1:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Zurie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Those don't look like die polishing lines to me, looks like a harsh cleaning, impaired proof. Maybe it looks different in hand.
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 Posted 10/19/2020  1:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
What is that black mark on the reverse above the Y in TWENTY?
Edited by Coinfrog
10/19/2020 1:41 pm
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 Posted 10/19/2020  1:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add keith12 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Look like Die Polishing lines to me.
Don't know about that black thing
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 Posted 10/19/2020  2:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looking at the enlarged images, the lines do not appear (at least to me) to cross any of the devices, so I'm thinking they are in fact die polishing lines that are just being captured in an unflattering light.
Edited by Coinfrog
10/19/2020 2:38 pm
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 Posted 10/19/2020  2:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ty2020b to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
A lot of them don't seem to pass over the devices, some do though. Seems unlikely PCGS would straight grade this if it wasnt die polishing, or maybe they REALLY dropped the ball .

Either way, not a fan.
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 Posted 10/19/2020  2:27 pm  Show Profile   Check GrapeCollects's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GrapeCollects to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm actually not sure it was cleaned, and hear me out. A lot of really rough and mishandled seated proofs that are uncleaned tend to get this appearance from their delicate surfaces. It could just be a mishandled proof, or cleaned. I'd need to see in hand
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 Posted 10/19/2020  4:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add daltonista to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Okay, thanks to all. I think I'll contact the seller for an answer about the mintmark space. Will keep you posted.

Wash your hands, everybody!
Tom
"I ain't good-looking, but I'm willing to try."
--- Dave "Snaker" Ray: 'It's All Right,' 1963
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 Posted 10/19/2020  10:52 pm  Show Profile   Check farrider11's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add farrider11 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If the die was polished, someone got mixed up and went to the hardware store for sand paper :)
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 Posted 10/20/2020  09:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add panzaldi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
most likely die polishing but as stated someone went a little overboard. possibly after polishing the dies several times you are going to get this look so this strike could be towards the end of the die use. I'm more concerned about the black mark which looks like permanent black marker. ignoring that I think the grade is correct but if that mark is on the coin then this coin should have been detailed
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 Posted 10/20/2020  09:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dave700x to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Talk about terrible images. I have to assume PCGS saw these as die polish lines under in hand examination and got it right. If not, market grading has reached a new low.....
1883-O Nut
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 Posted 10/20/2020  5:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add daltonista to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

My inquiry to the seller: "Hi ~ Can you tell me, please, what the black splotches on the reverse are? I see one on the eagle's wing near 9:00, and the other is where a mintmark would be. Many thanks in advance! Tom"

His response, in its entirety: "It appears to be carbon spots."

Caveat emptor, I guess...

"I ain't good-looking, but I'm willing to try."
--- Dave "Snaker" Ray: 'It's All Right,' 1963
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 Posted 10/21/2020  05:47 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Hunter611 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Interesting carbon mark; looks like a Sharpie flick.
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 Posted 10/21/2020  09:31 am  Show Profile   Check Lancek's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Lancek to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Count me in the die polishing lines column. But carbon spot? No, too dark and too uniform in color. Plus the edges on carbon spots tend to be more rounded. I wonder if this coin would benefit from a NGC or PCGS conservation? Sharpie mark seems plausible. And likely something that could be removed.
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