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Opinion - Why Gold Is Safer Than Your Savings Account

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Rest in Peace
biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 12/08/2011  7:59 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 12/09/2011  5:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The United States has become a nation of savers.

Bahahahahahahaha! Man, what IS this guy smoking? While the savings rate in the US has improved over the past few years, we are a LONG way from being a "nation of savers".

Also, equating paper PMs with physical PMs is a stretch as well. He mentions the possibility of a financial meltdown. Hmmm... isn't that the time when paper assets tend to disappear? If so, then a lot of those paper-holding folks could be in for a really rude surprise.

Other stats that I've read and that have been commented on in other threads hereabouts shows that the amount of gold sold in the US has declined considerably in recent years. It may be way up in Asia but not here. Not sure about the amount of silver sold here. That may or may not be up recently.
Rest in Peace
biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 12/10/2011  11:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That "nation of savers" struck me as comical too. I have Chinese friends who think nothing of keeping enough cash handy to buy a new car, which is more than about 50% of Merkins have saved for retirement.
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 12/11/2011  6:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Before I retired in 2004, I was saving 40-50% of my income. Now, THAT is saving. Most financial advisers try to get people to save 10-15% of their incomes for retirement. This is fine if one starts very early in life or plans to work until they are 65-70 years old. I planned to retire at age 55, which I did. Because my time horizon was shorter than most, I knew that I had to save as aggressively as I possibly could. I would be surprised if the average savings rate in the US was much more than about 3-4%.

There are a couple of graphs here:

http://www.creditwritedowns.com/201...81-2011.html

That show average US savings rates over both 5 year and 25 year time frames. It's difficult to tell what the average is from these but 4% or so looks close.

Of course, this does not include the forced savings that go into SS.

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junior e's Avatar
United States
931 Posts
 Posted 12/14/2011  11:50 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add junior e to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Now that Bank of America moved over $60 Trillion dollars in derivatives from Merril Lynch into their FDIC insured banking arm, the FDIC and the Treasury are on the hook for a complete wipeout from tha failure of just one bank. Alongside this wonderful patriotic development hundreds of other banks per year are failing.

I know of one guy who is quietly moving his savings into cash before the poo hits the fan.

He works at the branch where I hold all of my cash reserves.
Edited by junior e
12/14/2011 12:04 pm
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macmercury's Avatar
United States
5826 Posts
 Posted 12/14/2011  2:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add macmercury to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@Ed_B,

Bravo for sticking to your plan.

I wish I could of say the same, hopefully there aren't too many twists and turns down the road for myself. I was fortunate to have friend who help me got my new job in short time after I got layoff from my previous jobs of 10+ years. The company I'm in now required a 1 year lap before allowing new employee to participate into the company 401K, so it was hard for me to save in ways that I used to, as in between time I needed the cash.

Good thing for ebay, I know that most don't like their fees, but it kept me afloat for that short time period. Now I will be in my new 401K, I hope to pick up where I have left off.

All PM is down big time and the US dollar is up, so who is manipulating it? I know the China real estates is dropping, possibly a sell off is at stake, with people cashing in gold to buy it at lower prices?
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 12/14/2011  5:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Now that Bank of America moved over $60 Trillion dollars in derivatives from Merril Lynch into their FDIC insured banking arm...

Well, one thing about BofA is that when they decide to loot a treasury they do not use ANY half-way measures. It is crap like this that prevents me from doing ANY business with the likes of BofA, Chase, or JPM. A pox upon all their houses!


Quote:
I know of one guy who is quietly moving his savings into cash before the poo hits the fan. He works at the branch where I hold all of my cash reserves.

It's good that you know someone on the inside of this banking mess and that he is willing to say what he is doing with his own money. We will NOT be hearing any of this from the lame stream media. I too am getting edgy about the US banking system and its excesses, many of which were not cleaned up after the 2008 near-collapse. They put some lipstick on that pig and claimed that it was a beauty contest winner... wiener would be more like it. They are porking out at our expense... as usual. The huge derivative market is hanging over the entire monetary system of the world now. It is like a crane supporting a HUGE weight and the cable is fraying and making these little "TWANG!" sounds from time to time. This does not seem to me to be a great time to be taking up residence under that weight!


Quote:
Bravo for sticking to your plan.

Thanks, Mac. I had a secret weapon in that endeavor... a fine lady who has been my life's partner, best friend, confidant, and much else. She wasn't all that sure that my plan was right but she had faith in me and didn't interfere in what I was attempting to do for us. In spite of her reservations, she came to the conclusion that it had all been worth it and that my plan was sound. It was gratifying to get that confirmation.


Quote:
Now I will be in my new 401K, I hope to pick up where I have left off.

That's great, Mac. It's good that you got a new job and that you will be able to continue funding your 401k plan. I'm a big fan of the K plan! It has been one of the greatest wealth creating engines for the common man ever. This is not to say that most K plans can't be improved or that there aren't any other worthwhile investments out there. I really like the idea of the company match. That alone provides quite a return potential, even if the market isn't at the moment. The tax benefit is also significant. I do like the idea of "tax diversification" as well. If I were doing this all over again, I would try to use a Roth IRA early in my career when my income was lower and the tax deferral not as valuable and then use a 401k later on when my income was higher and the tax deferral more valuable. I would also put more into a taxable account so that I could reap the benefit of lower taxation when the investments were cashed in during retirement. A roughly 3-way split among these things should work well for most people and give them about as much flexibility as possible.


Quote:
All PM is down big time and the US dollar is up, so who is manipulating it?

Mostly it is the big bullion banks in London, along with JPM and HSBC. These are the guys with the BIG short positions that lower PM prices will allow them to unwind with minimal impact to their bottom lines. In short, it is the usual list of suspects. The PM market is greatly affected by religious, social, and political turmoil, so PM market moves are not necessarily based strictly on market manipulation.

Recent gold sell offs look a lot like investors selling off their winners to either capture the profits or raise capital to shore up other positions. It could also come from some fund managers who have some nice gains in gold that they want to bank before 2011 ends.
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junior e's Avatar
United States
931 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2011  3:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add junior e to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
As far as the derivatives go, I just wonder who in the heck of importance was so involved that they even consider helping out the big banks with their gambling problem.

If you go to Vegas and put ten million on red, you lose if black or green show up. Apparently major financial institutions can gamble, and hen they lose we have to pay their marker. I just get so frustrated wih the inequality of the system that I just don't believe anything that they do will ever be in the interests of the common

I wish that I was rich enough to pull up stakes and go far away from the crooks that have ruined this great nation. People say " Love it or leave it ". They must just be blind to what's really going on here.
Edited by junior e
12/15/2011 3:38 pm
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2011  6:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
People say " Love it or leave it ". They must just be blind to what's really going on here.

Wow, Junior, I haven't heard that expression since the good old days of the 1960s. Funny thing there was that a lot of young fellows DID leave. They went to Canada and that made the "love it or leave it" crowd even madder. Oh, well. We just can't please some folks, I guess.

But yes, love IS blind... or, at the very least, really near-sighted.

The fact that the banksters want to privatize their profits but socialize their losses is pathetic. It's legal for some obscene reason, but still pathetic. This is one industry that desperately needs to "man up". A terrible precedent was set by not letting ALL of the banks that were run by greed and stupidity just die. Banks that were better run would have scooped up their assets while their debts were written down or off. That would have cleaned up the entire banking system and it is very likely that after a couple of years to straighten it all out, we would be in the middle of a very strong bull market now. But no, we can't do that. We are so lilly-livered that we cannot possibly accept ANY pull-backs that the market desperately needs to cleanse itself of its own excesses. Someday, we will have people running this country who actually understand capitalism and economics. Things will be great when that happens. If it does not happen, then we will be in some very deep doo.
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alexander01's Avatar
1 Posts
 Posted 12/16/2011  12:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add alexander01 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Buying gold coins is one of the best and safest ways to invest in gold. Coins are usually more expensive; when it comes to the content of gold compared to bars. This is because gold coins are more expensive to manufacture. One benefit of gold coins over gold bars is it tends to build more numismatic value over time. The reason for this is most coins are struck with a date on it. The older the coin usually the more numismatic value it will build, once it is kept in good condition.
Rest in Peace
biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 12/18/2011  3:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
, alexander01!
New Member
Guillano's Avatar
United States
9 Posts
 Posted 12/19/2011  10:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Guillano to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi, so gold is now a good solid investment? Does it really give you a hedge in inflation?
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biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 12/20/2011  04:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
, Guillano!

Gold is a speculation, not an investment.

Overall, it's a hedge, but today's price is near its record highs, despite recent drops.

A more important function of gold is protection against a possible collapse of the dollar.

You decide the likelihood of that and buy accordingly.
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 12/20/2011  6:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree that gold and PMs in general are speculative. But then, so are any number of other investments.

For me, PMs are a hedge against inflation, the silent thief that steals the buying power of our savings. While gold prices seem high these days, they are significantly below the inflation adjusted high of 1980 or so. Back then, gold got up to about $850 an oz. In todays' dollars that would be around $2400 per oz. We're a good 1/3 below that amount now.

I have mixed thoughts about the dollar collapsing. While that could happen, it seems a long shot to me. Something far more likely is the dollars' purchasing power melting away from excessive money printing. The government can't print a lot more PMs like they can dollars, so PMs are pretty darn resistant to inflation.
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yankee1227's Avatar
United States
1151 Posts
 Posted 12/20/2011  6:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yankee1227 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well gold will always have some type of value, always. You can make money, but you can alson lose a lot.

As for savings accounts, I have $5,000 in my saving account, I am getting 21¢ per 6 monthes. Thats right,21¢! I can't believe it, but it's true. Kinda sad really.
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junior e's Avatar
United States
931 Posts
 Posted 12/21/2011  1:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add junior e to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The fact that The Fed is holding interest rates near zero is just robbing so much income from the thrifty and the elderly. At the same time the government allows financial institutions to charge interest rates upwards of 28% is appalling.

The same companies that gobbled up our tax money by the mega billions are licensed to rob us blind. Also the Treasury has no problem creating unbacked notes through the hidden inflation tax just boggles the mind.

Our founding fathers would read the news in amazement to find that the revolution has not yet begun. The tyrants have set up such an untouchable ruling and military machine that all but a few true patriots are just too afraid to shake the tree.

They have no problem moving the retirement age back to offset the inevitable bankruptcy of the system that "insures" the elderly a respectable end of life. Yet government wages, pensions, and retirement benefits are becoming cushier and fatter by the year.

It's just too much to accept sitting down. I know that life would be much smoother to just relax and watch the wheel go 'round, but some of us can't accept the injustice lying down.
Edited by junior e
12/21/2011 1:29 pm
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