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New Uncleaned Lot - New Interesting Finds

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Author Previous TopicReplies: 15 / Views: 1,178Next Topic  
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Archraz's Avatar
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3499 Posts
 Posted 01/26/2012  11:43 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Archraz to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hi everyone, I have today received a new lot of uncleaned coins from my usual seller. This time I have received a rather diverse lot. And I have three that are clear enough to ask you guys about, but I should preface this by saying that I have not tried to really clean any of the three yet. I think that the following are all very unusual, so I hope that my poor scans suffice.

1. I think that this might be a Justinian I minted in Constantinople (Which is odd since this was advertised as a lot of Roman coins from the 3rd-4th centuries) It is 20mm and fairly thick:


New-Uncleaned-Lot---New-Interesting-Finds

New-Uncleaned-Lot---New-Interesting-Finds

2. This coin appears to be Constantine I and it seems to be SILVERED! (It is very obvious that it is silvered when in hand). So any tips for cleaning silvered coins? I heard that lemon and lime juice are good for this. IS this so? Any other tips?


New-Uncleaned-Lot---New-Interesting-Finds

New-Uncleaned-Lot---New-Interesting-Finds

3. This last one appears to be a Constantius II Fallen Horseman type that we all know all too well, but the main difference is that it is huge. I have never seen anything like it. It is 21mm and as thick as about two US quarters stacked on top of on another. Is this an oddity for the type or is it another denomination that I have yet to encounter?


New-Uncleaned-Lot---New-Interesting-Finds

New-Uncleaned-Lot---New-Interesting-Finds
Edited by Archraz
01/26/2012 11:44 pm
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Bing's Avatar
United States
4253 Posts
 Posted 01/26/2012  11:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bing to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks like they will clean up well. Be careful with the silvered coin. The silver wash can be "washed" right off the coin. For a silver coin, not silvered, the lemon juice is a good cleaner. I'm not sure I would use it on this coin. I have no suggestions other than water and/or olive oil soaking.

The first coin is a Valentinian. I have not checked to see if it is a I or II so I'll let you attribute it as it is midnight here and I'm ready to call it a day.

Congrats and keep us posted.
Edited by Bing
01/26/2012 11:52 pm
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jessvc1's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2012  05:02 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jessvc1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
try some distilled water first and see what that does. Nice coins sounds like a heavy planchet on the fallen horseman coin. or maybe it was struck over another coin types planchet or it was maybe struck over another coin? What is the weight on it? I have some fallen horseman types that weigh almost 6 gms and around 23mm
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 Posted 01/27/2012  06:49 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dougsmit to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Falling Horseman coins were originally issued as the largest of three denominations in a currency reform under Constantius II c.346 AD. Brother Constans had the same reform but his larger coins were his choice of other types so Falling Horseman coins of Constans are rare. About that time inflation hit the economy and the newly issued coins started getting smaller. The other denominations were discontinued. Constans died so the only type that really suffered from the shrinking process was the horseman. You have one of the early ones before they got smaller.

I suppose it is heresy to some but a silvered coin in poor condition with patches missing can be treated like regular bronzes and might look better with no silver than with 25% patchy silver. On the other hand, freshly cleaned patchy silver coins tend to improve as they retone so ugly may get more acceptable in ten years or so.

I know no one wants to hear it but, I've seen more coins ruined in olive oil than helped. At least try distilled water first.

You guys have been a bad influence on me. I ordered a small lot of uncleaned coins to try some cleaning experiments. I regret that most coins I see offered are either partially cleaned (probably removed from the batch when it was obvious they were culls) of chipped on the edge (cleaning does not repair broken coins). I was hoping for round lumps of dirt but failed to find exactly what I was seeking. I feel a bit bad spending over $100 on something that my intent is to destroy but perhaps there will be a few $5 coins to offset the certain trash? I promise you there will be no oil baths or Ren-Wax. In a few weeks/months I'll report on how this goes.
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VisigothKing's Avatar
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4778 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2012  09:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add VisigothKing to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice pickups. I think they will clean up nicely. BTW what is your source for these uncleaned lots? I am thinking about getting into cleaning ancients hopefully soon and don't want to get lots with just slugs in them.
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bobbyhelmet's Avatar
United Kingdom
2838 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2012  11:38 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobbyhelmet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Be careful with the silvered coin, distilled water only to start with, even then I have had silvering peel off so keep an eye on it, no lemon juice.

I see a palm leaf to the left of the figure on it.
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Archraz's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2012  2:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Archraz to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the input, everyone!

jwharper- Thanks for IDing the first coin for me. Now that I think of it, my coin does seem a bit too nice in terms of design to be a Justinian coin. I think that it is RIC83a Valantinian II Constantinople mint.

dougsmit- Ah good to know that the fallen horseman type was once much larger. I take it that the larger, earlier versions are scarcer than the smaller, later ones, correct?

I'll let you guys know how these thee pan out and if the others in the lot prove to be of interest.
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echizento's Avatar
United States
23731 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2012  2:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice lot that should clean up nicely. I believe the first coin is Valentinian II based on the Chi-Rho in the left field which was used on many of his small bronze issues.
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Archraz's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2012  5:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Archraz to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Also, do you guys think that hydrogen peroxide would be too harsh on my silvered coin? I still find that in moderation it can do wonders for bronze coins.
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Archraz's Avatar
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3499 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2012  9:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Archraz to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I just scanned another from this lot. I suspect that this coin may have already been cleaned and just tossed in the lot due to the fairly poor legend. Is this a Claudius II?



New-Uncleaned-Lot---New-Interesting-Finds

New-Uncleaned-Lot---New-Interesting-Finds
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Bing's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2012  10:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bing to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It looks like Claudius II RIC 266
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echizento's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2012  11:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Claudius II, Memorial issue, Consecratio.
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Archraz's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2012  11:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Archraz to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
jwharper & echizento- Thanks for the help on this one! So wildwinds does not seem to say where it was minted. Since there is nothing in extremis, does this mean that it is minted in Rome?
Also, given the fact that it is oddly missing so much of the design due to being struck on a small planchet (or maybe it was badly clipped), what kind of value do you think that it has?
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Bing's Avatar
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 Posted 01/27/2012  11:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bing to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The coin was probably struck under Quintillus in AD 270. If this is true, then the only mints open to him were Rome, Milan, Siscia, and Cyzicus. I go by the mantra that when in doubt go with Rome mint. The likelihood is that most coins would have been struck in Rome even if they were also struck in other mints.

Value is so hard to pin down. According to Sear, in VF condition the coin would be worth about $25. Take a look on acsearch.info to see if you can get a value.
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VisigothKing's Avatar
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 Posted 01/28/2012  12:02 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add VisigothKing to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Same here, but usually with silver coins. If I can't find the mint, I'll go with Rome, since they minted alot of the silver coins (and was the only mint to do so for a long time from what I understand).
Edited by VisigothKing
01/28/2012 12:05 am
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DVCollector's Avatar
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10045 Posts
 Posted 01/28/2012  12:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Really great patina on that Claudius II too!
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