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 Replies: 16 / Views: 3,263 |
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New Member
United States
3 Posts |
Hello all Although I have been collecting bullion for some time, I recently began collecting coins and oh what a differance. I am learning just how much I don't know, anyway, to the point. I recently aquired an 1878 cc Trade dollar and need advice. The coin has the correct 27.2 gram weight and 38.1 mm dia., but with all the "fakes" out there, I need the experts to tell me whether or not I should send it to NGC for grading and verification. I will attempt to upload a couple pictures and any help offered will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help. Tony Lanier   |
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Moderator
 United States
188440 Posts |
 to the Community! I moved your topic to the proper forum for the appropriate attention it deserves. |
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New Member
 United States
3 Posts |
Thank you. Wasn't exactly sure where it should be.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1054 Posts |
Personally, I would send it off and see what happens. There's just something off about the coin itself, the rim is in different thicknesses for a coin so sharply struck. And there seems to be some soft struck spots that would indicate a cast copy. I don't know, I'm sure someone who specializes in Seated and Trade dollars can help out you more. |
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New Member
United States
3 Posts |
I agree. What's puzzling is the dimensions and weight seem correct from what I can find.
Thanks for the reply, think I will ship it off and see what happens.
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
Welcome to Coin Community, tjlanier. 1878-CC is by far the rarest of the circulating Trade dollars, and anyone who's sold a Trade dollar knows that. The coin you show here is worth nearly $10,000 if real. Only some 93,000 were minted - lowest in the series - and half of those were melted. I believe only one die pair was used, which makes sense because the total mintage was well within the capability of a single die pair. There was, therefore, only one mint mark location. Your coin does not have that mint mark location. I feel that submitting it would be sending good money after bad. This one doesn't look remotely close to real - the mint mark, the location of E PLURIBUS UNUM, the branch in her hand, the "hollow" area at the bottom of the eagle's left wing - it's all wrong. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12437 Posts |
Where did you acquire this coin? Unfortunately, there is basically zero chance that it is genuine. There are only two Trade dollars tougher than the 1878CC- the 1884 Proof with a mintage of 10 and the 1885 Proof with a mintage of 5. As SuperDave mentioned, this coin would be very valuable if it was genuine. In addition to the mintmark being in the wrong location, the ends of the LIBERTY ribbon are pointing the wrong direction and the position of the arrowhead over the 420 is wrong- both diagnostics for the design of the earlier dates in the series. The surfaces do not look like that of a silver coin, I suspect that it is thicker than normal to account for full weight in a white metal composition. It could also possibly be a billon silver alloy(<50% Ag) but the only easy way to determine the composition would be to perform a Specific Gravity test. |
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New Member
United States
3 Posts |
I acquired the coin from a 60ish woman who was selling some of her recently deceased fathers collection, so she said. We talked for some time and I had no reason to doubt her then or now. She just did not strike me as being dishonest. Even now if it turns out to be fake, I am sure she did not know.
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
Oh, there's no doubt of that - innocent people have been getting taken by Trade dollar fakes for almost 150 years. They've been counterfeited from the day they were minted. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1796 Posts |
Aye, I will corroborate the bad news: This Trade dollar is with little doubt a cast counterfeit. The lack of details and poorness of the strike plus the graininess of what details there are plus it being the proper weight (one missing *that* much detail would be a bit less) are a testament to this. I don't have an example of this variety in The Black Cabinet yet. Tjlanier, would you consider submitting it? Edited by SteveCaruso
03/26/2012 2:00 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1348 Posts |
Thats too bad. This would have been a real find.
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21788 Posts |
The last 'T' in 'TRUST' looks like a '7'. It is a really nice fake! In my opinion, everybody who collects Trade dollars, should also collect as many fakes as possible as well. It seems that there a lot of them out there to collect! Reason? You have a reference set of fakes for personal education purposes, to enable you to spot the genuine ones! |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
I agree the woman probably didn't know the coin was fake when she sold it to you, these things have been faked and fooling people since right after they started circulating over 130 years ago and the problem has done nothing but get worse since then. I do not believe yours is one of those first counterfeits as it looks like it is a cast copy of a Trade dollar which would put it in the modern category. When it comes to Trade dollars I always try to tell the new collector to either buy in a reputable TPG holder from a reputable person or wait until you are comfortable with your ability to be able to spot a fake before you buy. These things have been fooling people for many years and I don't see it stopping anytime soon Quote:everybody who collects Trade dollars, should also collect as many fakes as possible that is not a bad idea as long as they are buying them as being fake and not paying real Trade dollar prices for a fake |
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Rest in Peace
United States
9104 Posts |
, tjlanier! check out http://www.pcgs.com/photograde/#/Trade/GradesThere is detail in the leaves Liberty is holding, and the centers of the stars are points, not circles. Overall, a deceptive counterfoot I would not waste money having a TPG look at. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1304 Posts |
I am still trying to learn about Trade dollars myself. The bottom of the "7" looks strange to me. Great reading these posts, sorry it's a fake tjlanier.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7840 Posts |
Curious on how much you paid for it.  Edited by oih82w8
03/27/2012 8:09 pm
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Replies: 16 / Views: 3,263 |
Posted 03/26/2012 11:21 am
