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 Replies: 17 / Views: 2,572 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
808 Posts |
I doubt any of us ever really think about it, but it's amazing to me how easy it is to trade PMs today. There are plenty of competitive LCS and online dealers catering to everyone from the casual collector to serious investor. If you've got the scratch, it's just as easy to buy a "monster box" as it is to pickup a single coin, and do so without paying an unreasonable commission. Also, unless you are dealing with a high-end broker, there are no minimums on the number of coins purchased.
Here's my question: has bullion buying always been this easy?
I'm thinking that in 1986, the year the American Eagles debuted, bullion buying must have been a very different experience. Does anyone recall what those early years were like in terms of buying and selling?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3670 Posts |
Coinwatch, I figure silver has been real easy to acquire in bulk or any amount since it crashed down next to nothing back in the early 80's....
I always use an example of a trip to New York my mom made in 2001, not long after the towers went down. She bought a large amount of twin tower silver rounds way back then, an gave most of them out for Christmas, as some of my family still mentions having one of them in their safe keeping....
Their eye's get big when I tell them she bought them all for about 10 each and how much they are worth today, back when silver was 4 bucks per oz.. Sounds about right, street vendor marking them up an making four or five each per coin....
I had eleven of them, an sold most last year when silver was over 40 per oz. for about 75 each, as they bring a big premium now being the coins released the year of 911. The ones released since, don't command no where as much premium....
Edited by Silverhawk74
04/19/2012 2:59 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5854 Posts |
I wouldn't have any first hand experience of what it was like to purchase physical bullion back in 1986 since I was not even born but from my dad's experience it does not seem to be a whole lot different. He told me that he purchased around 50 Kuggerrands from a dealer up in NH during the early years of the Canadian Maple leaf. He eventually had to sell them to a dealer in order to be able to put a down payment on a house back in 1986. The spreads(for him about 10%) appear to be a bit wider than they are today and the product offering a bit more limited but otherwise the general transaction appears to be the same as today. Large purchases may have required a bit more patience but a dealer could always call up another dealer and eventually get what you want.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1454 Posts |
Good question. At the coin shop level, not much has changed. I doubt. I imagine the big difference is the internet and personal access to a global market.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4008 Posts |
Quote:
He told me that he purchased around 50 Kuggerrands from a dealer up in NH during the early years of the Canadian Maple leaf. He eventually had to sell them to a dealer in order to be able to put a down payment on a house back in 1986. People often sell investments so they can use the money to buy something else. Once in a while you read a story here or there from someone who did this only to have the stock go WAY up in price shortly thereafter. I once read a cute story of that type called "The $50,000 Washing Machine" or something real close to that. I hope that it washed his clothes REALLY well!  As to bullion buying... I don't know what it was like back in the mid 1980s. I was much too busy building a career and making money in the stock market to worry about it. I do know that back in the 1950s and 1960s, there wasn't that much bullion buying going on. All you had to do back then if you wanted silver bullion was sort through your pocket change!  |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
808 Posts |
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As to bullion buying... I don't know what it was like back in the mid 1980s. I was much too busy building a career and making money in the stock market to worry about it. This was certainly the attitude around my house growing up: stock, commodities contracts, and real estate were considered the investment vehicles of choice. Bullion was never on the radar. What got me started on this thread was a very hazy memory of being at a fall rush party and listening to this friend of a friend going on and on about how his dad was going to invest in the new "American [Gold] Eagle" bullion coins. I don't recall the name of the dealer/broker but I vaguely recall a minimum of 50 coin purchase and an outrageous commission schedule. I quickly exited the conversation. There were more interesting things going on anyway.  And, honestly, there wan't enough beer in the world to make what he was saying sound like a good deal. That one conversation totally turned me off on PMs for the next 20+ years. Edited by coinwatch
04/20/2012 12:44 am
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Rest in Peace
United States
9104 Posts |
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I'm thinking that in 1986, the year the American Eagles debuted, bullion buying must have been a very different experience. Does anyone recall what those early years were like in terms of buying and selling? Before eagles, there were krands, before rounds there were bars. I've done six-figure deals back then, no problem. |
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Rest in Peace
United States
9104 Posts |
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I do know that back in the 1950s and 1960s, there wasn't that much bullion buying going on. All you had to do back then if you wanted silver bullion was sort through your pocket change! Nor, as you point out, was there any need. Gold was readily available, just name your country. One of the Canadian banks made a daily buy/sell market in all the popular ones. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
808 Posts |
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Before eagles, there were krands, before rounds there were bars. I've done six-figure deals back then, no problem. biggfredd, that's kinda my point. Big trades on the order of five and six figure deals (and larger) were the norm back then and I have no doubt were easy to execute. What's different today is that the PM market is infinitely more accessible to the small collector and investor executing comparatively modest buys in the hundreds and low thousands of dollars. Or at least that's my impression. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
619 Posts |
I remember seeing signs advertising the new AGEs and ASEs about 25 years ago, when my parents went to their small-town bank. If only I had saved up my allowance to buy those, instead of cheap plastic toys...
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4008 Posts |
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If only I had saved up my allowance to buy those, instead of cheap plastic toys... There's a tremendous life-lesson there, my friend. Put your hard earned money into that which is REAL and not that which is fun. Lots of people spend a lot more money than they realize on toys and entertainment and then wonder why they cannot retire when they want. A comfortable retirement is THE best gift you can give yourself, so make an effort to invest in that. It really is important. I would not trade the freedom that I have in retirement for all the money in the world. More money, I can get. Getting more time is a LOT more difficult. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
808 Posts |
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Valued Member
United States
410 Posts |
I'm curious if the buy / sell spread is larger today than in the past. There are at least five "WE BUY GOLD / SILVER" shops on my way to work. I stopped into a few looking to sell some old jewelry and they all offered 50 to 60% of spot.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
808 Posts |
@JSH - It's pure speculation on my part but, much like the advent of the Internet-based discount brokerage brought down the cost and barriers to easily trading equities, educated and informed PM investors today have better access to more products, and at lower commission cost, than ever before.
I'd love to find some hard numbers somewhere on commissions and spreads from back in the day. I think it would be very revealing.
Edited by coinwatch
04/24/2012 01:07 am
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Rest in Peace
United States
9104 Posts |
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I stopped into a few looking to sell some old jewelry and they all offered 50 to 60% of spot. I suspect the market is getting thinner. I know we've already lost one corporate buyer in town. 50-60% of spot for scrap in small quantities from the generally pubic is not unreasonable. Between overhead, holding laws, fluctuating to flat markets, stolen and fake stuff, these 80%+ buyers are just asking to have their heads handed to them. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4008 Posts |
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It's pure speculation on my part but, much like the advent of the Internet-based discount brokerage brought down the cost and barriers to easily trading equities, educated and informed PM investors today have better access to more products, and at lower commission cost, than ever before.
I'd love to find some hard numbers somewhere on commissions and spreads from back in the day. I think it would be very revealing. Thanks to the Internet, people have HUGELY better access, period. Back in the day, it was typical for a broker to handle all stock transactions and often got $200-400 in commissions for trades that can now be done for $5-10 each. Like you, I suspect that the spreads on just about all manner of shopping has narrowed considerably thanks to the competition from on-line vendors. I agree that having some good numbers on this would make for a useful and interesting comparison. |
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Replies: 17 / Views: 2,572 |
Posted 04/19/2012 6:32 pm
