| Author |
 Replies: 10 / Views: 974 |
|
|
Rest in Peace
United States
954 Posts |
Hello Everyone, While reading Coin World today I found that Ohio is going to sell off it coin investment holdings that equal some 18 Billion dollars. My questions are this. What effect do you think this sell off will have on the overall coin market..? and How will it effect, if any, your coin buying and selling.catman  |
|
|
|
Forum Mom
 United States
5877 Posts |
Personally, I think the coin market could absorb this sale with no problem.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
2724 Posts |
It really depends on what the holdings include. As Mr. Noe has not made the holdings public, it is hard to tell exactly what the market will do. If these coins are at the upper levels of the market, it will have very little effect. I expect that one or more of the major auction houses will have major influence on how these are marketed. I expect that the thought of "slowly" entering these coins into market is to ensure their values. As an example if the majority of the coins are better dated MS-66 Morgan dollars, it would crumple the market on these coins for all of us who deal in them. If they are as many expect, common dated coins, it will have very little effect on the market, but may make for great news as the total is far less than expected. |
|
Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts |
I strongly suspect that Noe and Capitol Coin have a very large collection of very over-graded coins although they probably also have some pretty decent specimens. But, if a large number of their high grades are self-graded (e.g. by Capitol Coin Grading Service), that $18 billion is gonna shrink real fast. Further, if a large number of the coins are in low- or non-tiered TPG slabs, what auction house is gonna peddle them? I agree with previous posts that the release of these coins into the market will probably not have any direct impact on the market; I shudder at the secondary impact such a release might have on the numismatic world in terms of public relations if the majority of the coins prove to be far less than advertised and unsuspecting people purchase them only to find out they've been defrauded. |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
980 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by Morgan Fred
I strongly suspect that Noe and Capitol Coin have a very large collection of very over-graded coins although they probably also have some pretty decent specimens. But, if a large number of their high grades are self-graded (e.g. by Capitol Coin Grading Service), that $18 billion is gonna shrink real fast. Further, if a large number of the coins are in low- or non-tiered TPG slabs, what auction house is gonna peddle them? I agree with previous posts that the release of these coins into the market will probably not have any direct impact on the market; I shudder at the secondary impact such a release might have on the numismatic world in terms of public relations if the majority of the coins prove to be far less than advertised and unsuspecting people purchase them only to find out they've been defrauded.
The state of Ohio made two $25M disbursemnts to the fund. In addition, Noe, holds 5.4M of state funs which represent alleged profits reinvested in the fund. As Noe has refused to say what the fund holdings are, it is unclear what it contains, but hints include two coins reported stolen by an employee of the fund- an 1855 $3 stella, and an 1855 eagle allegedly worth about $300,000. 119 additional coins are allegedly missing and valued at around $100,000. Noe also lent $850,000 to an associate from the Bureau of Workers compensation fund, which has been written off as bad bebt. Undisclosed property ion New Jersey is collateral for still further loans from the fund, but I forget the details. Noe barred state inspectors from inventorting the coins yesterday, per the Toledo Blade. ND has posted most of the Toledo Blade's articles on"coingate" in links below (in coins in the news), and a timeline with related TB article links at the bottom is here: http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbc...S24/50524002Don Edited by SFDukie
05/24/2005 8:48 pm
|
|
Valued Member
United States
458 Posts |
Personnally, if you read the previous post--I believe if fraud is proven, the holdings, if they do exists in those numbers, won't do squat to the market  Now if losses or fraud or items have been stolen, bartered, used a collateral etc etc--for sure it won't matter cause it'll be in the courts past the day I die so it don't matter  So answer to your original ? catman, NO effect at all--18B is just a drop in the ole bucket  |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
980 Posts |
Is $18B the size of the total coin market in the US on a yearly basis?
|
|
Pillar of the Community
Australia
1091 Posts |
Supply and Demand. If you release lots of coins the demand goes down as does the price.
Hoarding 18 BILLION dollars worth of coins would have already inflated the price of the remaining coins on the market. The release of this hoard MUST bring down the prices of the TYPE of coins being released.
It will also mean that buyers, who buy these coins will have less money to spend on other types of coins. Less buyers, less demand, lower prices on other coins.
For those who are cashed up, when the prices fall, it may be a time to get a real bargain.
Even if 18 billion is an over estimate of the hoards value, a couple billion dollars worth of rare coins would still effect the prices in the market, in my opinion. (I am not an expert--this is just my guesswork)
Edited by toast
05/24/2005 9:23 pm
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
1247 Posts |
|
|
Valued Member
United States
458 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by SFDukie
Is $18B the size of the total coin market in the US on a yearly basis?
Good question, but if you take what I read from another thread's web posting, the entire usa coin business is 3-5B dollars annually, so if it is 18B it is 3 1/2 times the annual biz---which to me right now looks like lotta BS  Edited by CiScO
05/25/2005 6:38 pm
|
|
Rest in Peace
United States
2884 Posts |
I thought the state invested $50 million in rare coins. Where is this $18 Billion number coming from? I see an auction this size having little to no effect on the rare coin market as a whole, unless records are set from individual pieces. We still don't know what's "missing" from the fund. So far it seems that $5.4 million in "profits" is not accounted for, yet! Mike
|
| |
Replies: 10 / Views: 974 |
|
Posted 05/24/2005 2:43 pm
