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 Replies: 8 / Views: 1,652 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1397 Posts |
  One is debt free and the other is not. I was talking to a teller the other day at the bank and was surprised to know that she didn't even know that the Federal Reserve is not a government agency, but rather a privately owned bank. Nor did she know the difference between debt and debt free currency. So after I finished talking to her about it I figured I would open a discussion here about it as well. This discussion, like an iceberg, has a small amount in plain view but the mother-load is below the surface where we can't see it. A green seal note is a Federal Reserve note and after it is printed the government has to borrow it from this privately owned bank in the form of debt. For every dollar printed and borrowed the national debt grows. We in turn are then taxed so that the government can attempt to pay this debt off. A red seal note is a US note printed by the government and is debt free since the government doesn't have to borrow it. Since they can produce all the money they want on their own there is no need to tax us because there is no debt. Our country ran with debt free money up to the time JFK was president and then it stopped. So why doesn't the government print its own money today? There is no law against it as provided by our constitution. Some people say that if the government were to print its own money there would be uncontrolled spending and inflation. Well, the way the system works now there is uncontrolled spending and inflation, so the only difference is we would be without the huge national debt that will soon sink this country like the Titanic running headlong into that fatal iceberg. So the difference between these two notes is similar to the difference between construction and demolition.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5830 Posts |
Thanks for the info Nickelman,
Is just another loop hole our government create extended debt crisis, let the next office holding administration take care of it, and the next and so on.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1285 Posts |
Nick...nice write up  On the other hand this can get some unneeded comments.  |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1397 Posts |
Quote:
let the next office holding administration take care of it, and the next and so on And therein lies the problem. How many next's do we have until the rubber band is stretched so tight it snaps? And when it snaps we are all in serious trouble. The USA is no longer a producing nation, but rather a consuming one. In other words we import nearly everything we sell in this country. One of the reasons we are able to do this is because our currency is accepted by most of the world and they are still extending us credit. It won't be too much longer until this grinds to a halt. Quote:
this can get some unneeded comments I can't wait to read them. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3692 Posts |
Look at the $1 bill. I believe it was the first to usurp the silver certificate in 1935. The Federal Reserve has been around for a long time now but it was only after silver was taken out of circulation that the FR Notes went 100% into power. Before that they were backed up by the promise of real money (Gold and Silver). The wording on them tickles me, saying that you can exchange them for lawful money, therefore it follows that FRNs are unlawful money. Even just by the wording on US Notes, they have no actual promise, so which is worse? I say that modern FRNs are the worst because you don't even have a choice anymore. US Notes circulated along with gold and silver certificates and FRNs. FRNs WERE legal tender AND a promise to pay in lawful money. They aren't anymore. It's a crazy game of hot potato now.
Edited by Libertad
10/05/2012 7:52 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1397 Posts |
The federal Reserve has been around since its creation in 1913 when Woodrow Wilson signed it into existence. Prior to that there were other private banks doing the same thing like the 1st and 2nd Banks Of the United States which operated not long after our nation was born.
One of the problems with gold and silver being forms of currency is that it puts wealth directly into the hands of the people, and those supplies are limited. When currency like silver certificates were issued it put worthless paper into the hands of the people and concentrated the silver and gold out of reach of the common man. Yes I am aware that a note could be redeemed for gold or silver, so the next step was to create currency that wasn't backed by anything.
It has been proven that currency does not need to be backed by anything, but it does need to be regulated. When ever currency is printed irresponsibly it always will devalue it to the point of being worthless.
As far as FRN's being unlawful, the writers of the constitution failed to put in a clause that restricted the printing of money to Congress and that opened the door for powerful private bankers to gain control over the money system. When Andrew Jackson took office he put a stop to that and became the only US president to pay off the national debt. But of course those powerful bankers would again take control they don't want debt free money since they have virtually unlimited wealth and power with our current system.
Edited by Nickelman
10/05/2012 9:18 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2295 Posts |
Very nice notes and great info to share.
So what would happen if we went back to the US notes? And is it even possible to do that again, with such a massive amount of debt?
It would be interesting to see what would happen if we got rid of the Federal Reserve. I have read articles about it being bad and that they need to go away. I just don't know the pros and cons of having the Federal Reserve. It would be interesting to read about though. Anyone care to list them?
What are other major countries doing?
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3692 Posts |
Nickelman said: " Quote:
One of the problems with gold and silver being forms of currency is that it puts wealth directly into the hands of the people, and those supplies are limited. When currency like silver certificates were issued it put worthless paper into the hands of the people and concentrated the silver and gold out of reach of the common man. " One of the solutions was always to devalue the silver by making the coin smaller/lighter or by lowering the purity. Of course, this, too, could be manipulated by creating a fake shortage of money. I think silver certificates were the "gateway" reserve note. The main arguments for paper money is that 1) if they were stolen the actual money was not taken and it's still sitting in the bank, and 2) that paper is easier to carry. The problem lies with the marketplace acepting and recirculating these essentially cancelled cheques en lieu of real money that sits in the bank and doesn't serve any further function. You wouldn't take a person's cancelled cheques, so why would you trust the government's, or that of a separate corporation, for that matter? People put too much trust into things that are written on paper. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1397 Posts |
Quote:
It would be interesting to see what would happen if we got rid of the Federal Reserve. I have read articles about it being bad and that they need to go away. Being able to print and regulate currency puts into the hands of the people doing so virtually unlimited power. To give that awesome power into the hands of non elected officials who don't have to answer to the voter or be subjected to audits is insane. These people regulate our money and make it valuable or worthless. Try to take that power away and watch what happens. Many people throughout history (like Jefferson and Jackson to name a couple) have warned about doing so. Those people with the power now are entrenched and won't like debt free money as it will be a threat to their power. Every time our country has gotten away from these private banks like the 1st and 2nd Bank of the United States they don't just go away quietly. Any candidate running for president today that suggests doing so will never make it to the office of president due to the power of those who REALLY run the country. |
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Replies: 8 / Views: 1,652 |
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Posted 10/05/2012 5:46 pm
