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Pms Opening Strong This Week Heading Toward Black Friday...

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Pillar of the Community
Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 11/21/2012  9:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
"I don't care what it does right now as long as there's a post-Christmas plummet so I can use my wife's bonus and buy a stack of stuff..."

And she's OK with that? Man, you are one heckuva salesman!
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Silverhawk74's Avatar
United States
3670 Posts
 Posted 11/23/2012  11:25 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silverhawk74 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Pmz are breaking out in Black Friday-just as expected.
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Fat Freddy's Avatar
United States
1200 Posts
 Posted 11/23/2012  3:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Fat Freddy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
WHAM!! 10am=$33.49 & 1pm=$34.09 --- a 1.8% increase in 3hrs flat. This is my first year following PM prices & I'm impressed!

1. Is this a typical Black Friday thing?
2. Is there also usually a post-Xmas plummet?
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hockingzig's Avatar
United States
1450 Posts
 Posted 11/24/2012  10:31 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hockingzig to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think most of this jump was Eurozone inspired! Things are not looking too good for a "remedy" to the European debt situation.
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 11/24/2012  7:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Every time I look at the EU situation, it makes me wonder not whether there will be a solution to all this but whether one is even possible.

Anyone ever make a "fish trap"? It's basically just a loosely woven basket that allows a fish to swim into it but has some prongs that catches on their gills and does not allow the fish to back up to get out of it. The EU countries seem like fish in a fish trap to me. They have gotten themselves into a nice comfy hiding place that they now cannot escape.
Bedrock of the Community
basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 11/24/2012  8:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The simple solution and the one that seems more likely would be the EU countries not doing so bad or Germany who is doing well saying weve had enough, fix your problems or were going back to our own money since were sick of paying for your mistakes
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tpg22's Avatar
United States
919 Posts
 Posted 11/24/2012  9:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tpg22 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The Euro moved from 1.275 to almost 1.30 earlier this week. That kind of a move will always make commodities move higher. As the dollar drops Gold/Silver will shine.
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hockingzig's Avatar
United States
1450 Posts
 Posted 11/25/2012  12:12 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hockingzig to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Ed,I think your analogy is exactly appropriate. I am convinced that all of the maneuvering going on is just to buy time to get banks stabilized then the weak sisters will be cut loose and left to bleed to death. It will be every man for himself when that occurs and the chaos it will create may well send PMs stratospheric. It will be interesting to see how they deal with all of the CDS's floating around attached to all that Eurozone debt!
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2012  7:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I am convinced that all of the maneuvering going on is just to buy time to get banks stabilized then the weak sisters will be cut loose and left to bleed to death.

Yep, just like here in the US, where there are all manner of shenanigans designed to support the dollar via manipulating PM prices lower and discouraging people from buying them and holding dollars.


Quote:
It will be every man for himself when that occurs and the chaos it will create may well send PMs stratospheric.

Dare we say "vertical"?


Quote:
It will be interesting to see how they deal with all of the CDS's floating around attached to all that Eurozone debt!

That's a fact, Hock. All these EU problems look a bit like a new carpet that has just been laid only to have a BIG bump in the middle of the floor and all the installers are walking around it, shrugging, and saying "what bump?!"

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hockingzig's Avatar
United States
1450 Posts
 Posted 11/29/2012  08:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hockingzig to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have heard the last day or so that all the maneuvering is positioning for Greek debt forgiveness. At present there is no legal way to do it but if they legislate it,it could be done. How you avoid CDS's if you forgive debt is a mystery but they will scheme and scam till they find a way!
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 11/30/2012  4:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
At present there is no legal way to do it but if they legislate it,it could be done.

Getting 17 separate countries to agree on much of anything is a tremendous task. I wish them well with this but wonder if it is simply beyond human capability. They say that "politics is the art of the possible", but this problem may well be impossible.


Quote:
How you avoid CDS's if you forgive debt is a mystery but they will scheme and scam till they find a way!

I have no idea, either, because a CDS is basically an insurance instrument that guarantees the payment on time and in full of another financial instrument, such as a bond. If the sovereign bonds / debt are "forgiven" then it is pretty clear that the CDS owners will demand that they get paid by the CDS seller. If the CDS seller is a weak EU bank, they may not have the financial resources necessary to repay the CDS's they have sold. I don't know how they could work this other than to print the money, give it to the bank, and have them pay off the CDS's that they have sold and that are now due because of "forgiveness" of debt; which looks VERY much like a dead bond that isn't going to pay the interest or return the principal to the people who own it. There are so many layers of this stuff and it covers the globe in multiple ways. Unwinding these is going to make undoing the Gordian Knot look simple by comparison.
Bedrock of the Community
basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 11/30/2012  9:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Getting 17 separate countries to agree on much of anything is a tremendous task. I wish them well with this but wonder if it is simply beyond human capability. They say that "politics is the art of the possible", but this problem may well be impossible.


Hence the problem with these global currency ideas, to many foxes in the hen house. Only takes a few bad apples to ruin it for everyone.


Quote:
I don't know how they could work this other than to print the money, give it to the bank, and have them pay off the CDS's that they have sold and that are now due because of "forgiveness" of debt


If weve learned one thing from Europe its that they have no problems with taking money. 75% ultra wealthy tax in france for example. With their mindset my assumption is if they did it they would just say to bad live with it it was for the greater good.
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 12/04/2012  6:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Hence the problem with these global currency ideas, to many foxes in the hen house. Only takes a few bad apples to ruin it for everyone.

There may well come a time when there is a real global currency but that time is not yet here. Any EU country can stop a financial rule from being created or changed, as they all seem to have veto power. They have a monetary union but not a fiscal one and that is not a combo that can work. The USA has a single currency for our 50 states and it works well because the states cannot tell the federal government how to implement monetary policy. One voice governs such decisions, not many.


Quote:
If weve learned one thing from Europe its that they have no problems with taking money.

LOL! Does ANY government have that problem? Not that I have noticed. Yes, some politicians pretend that taxing us is a bad thing but they keep right on doing it anyway... probably protesting just for show and re-election commercials.


Quote:
75% ultra wealthy tax in france for example.

Perhaps they will soon discover that lots of businesses can operate anywhere and do not need to be run in France. Might also discover that entrepreneurs do not have roots on their feet and can go just about anywhere on Earth where they can find better financial treatment. When taxes become repressive, creative people and companies will always find ways to reduce them to more manageable levels.


Quote:
With their mindset my assumption is if they did it they would just say to bad live with it it was for the greater good.

History shows that those pushing "the greater good" theory are responsible for far more than their share of atrocities in this world of ours. That is the beauty of the American Republic... it specifically rejects the greater good theory and defends the rights of the individual... most of the time, anyway.
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