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Valued Member
United States
329 Posts |
Bottoms are only apparent after the fact. Same thing with tops. In between there is just cash management.
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Valued Member
Ireland
131 Posts |
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Ok no more bickering and finger pointing. Going forward, I am going to just concentrate on the price action for those who want to know whats going on and that's it. Yes, please do keep it on topic and stop making your little digs at various types of people here and there. Perhaps you can't help your incredibly condescending tone in many of your posts but you most certainly can help avoiding the little snide and snarky remarks that are often based on some very general assumptions on your part or just plain rude. Such as assuming that everyone who buys the dips just sits and holds and doesn't also work the peaks. Such as assuming that even those that do buy the dips and hold are underwater on their purchases when for all you know many of them may have also bought on the dips on the way up and are actually far from underwater on their investment. Such as assuming everyone that offers a contrary viewpoint to yours has a bias toward gold and silver when that is not necessarily the case, perhaps some like myself just take exception to what has thus far been a high and mighty attitude towards the good people of this forum. Whether you are right or wrong in your beliefs is of no importance to me, I just hope this thread can be continued on in a more civil manner. Norm |
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Valued Member
Canada
470 Posts |
This thread has become a "laughing stock".
PM's and their price/market value are heavily manipulated.
To deny this is absolutely degenerate and thoroughly misleading.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1590 Posts |
Barry brought up the premiums on physical. Around here, central Ohio, the premium on silver is 10 percent. That is spot plus ten percent. The premium on gold is just plain stupid. And really is meant to discourage buyers. We had a very hot time two weeks ago, but now we have stock that is just sitting there with NO buyers. People on the street are spooked. They see the price going up and THE EXPECT IT to go DOWN.
All this talk about physical buying bringing the market up, is old news. That buying has largely dried up. It is one of those ironies that the action that drove the price up, physical buying, has killed physical buying. Except of course as a shill tactic for the ETF guys are still trying to drive the prices up to recoup their losses.
And let me say, that while Yup and I don't always agree, I do appreciate his taking his time to help people with no thought of financial remuneration. I do appreciate the fact that he wants to help people, bottom line.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2168 Posts |
A little off topic but if anyone is interested the mint just put the 5 oz Chaco Culture back for sale at 179 95. Not a bad deal considering all the premiums now
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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This thread has become a "laughing stock".
PM's and their price/market value are heavily manipulated.
To deny this is absolutely degenerate and thoroughly misleading. To state that with zero proof or evidence other than you think it should be higher is misleading and disingenuous. Youre just stating what you want to happen as fact Quote:
Again, I am strictly talking about physical gold and silver. Keep in mind its all the same. Theres no price disconnect between that and spot, a week or two of gouging as people try and recover their losses doesn't make for a new way of doing business. People will get sick of it and stop buying, buying is down already and sooner or later the premiums will be as well. I do agree though its a bad time to buy physical with the gouging. That will change though Quote:
So you recommend selling any investment the second it goes underwater? It depends what it is. If the companies falling apart yes, if its just a bad day for the market likely not. Its hard to speak generally but you have to figure out if the down trend is from the market in general being down of there is something wrong with that specific investment. If you conclude its that investment selling is one at option, at the very least you probably wouldnt put more into it. If its just a general down trend like the market saw in 08 though a good number of companies became good buys when they bottomed out |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5879 Posts |
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Keep in mind its all the same. In some regards, sure. However, while I know nothing about trading ETFs, I'm guessing the procedure involved in actually buying and selling them is very different than the procedure involved in buying physical. When you buy paper gold and silver, are you at the whim of dealer markups? Do you have to worry about not being able to find any sellers in your area? Conversely, is it possible to "sell short" when dealing with physical gold and paper? |
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Valued Member
United States
410 Posts |
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A little off topic but if anyone is interested the mint just put the 5 oz Chaco Culture back for sale at 179 95. Not a bad deal considering all the premiums now So that comes out to $36 per ounce or 50% premium over spot. Personally I think that is a horrible price for silver but it is a beautiful coin. So whether that is a good price or not depends on if you are a collector or a stacker. I also see that the mint has decided to price the Silver Proof Set at $67.95 which is the exact same price as last year's set. I see that as an outrageously markup considering that silver has dropped $8 per ounce. I won't be purchasing one from the Mint and will look for one on ebay next year. I'm really only interested in the ATB Quarters and the Native American dollar. |
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Valued Member
Canada
470 Posts |
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To state that with zero proof or evidence QE IS OBVIOUS. What happens when you take it away? wHO IS GETTING RICHER?WHO IS GETTING POORER? |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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When you buy paper gold and silver, are you at the whim of dealer markups? Do you have to worry about not being able to find any sellers in your area? Conversely, is it possible to "sell short" when dealing with physical gold and paper? Thats a fair point there are no dealer markups and you can sell with the click of a mouse. There are some small differences but for many many years now the move in spot has moved the price of physical. Of course you have to pay the markup for the mint to make their money that that premium had been consistent until everyone got underwater and started gouging. But if it was a 4 dollar mark up it was 4 at 30 or 4 at 40 it didnt really change until they didnt like the way the price was moving. They can gouge for a bit, but that will only last for so long before people say enough and their sales suffer greatly Quote:
QE IS OBVIOUS. What happens when you take it away?
wHO IS GETTING RICHER?WHO IS GETTING POORER? Which is in no way shape or form proof that metals are manipulated like you claimed. Edited by basebal21
05/02/2013 2:51 pm
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
3789 Posts |
and Jim sums it up well. I want to help out in the direction of this trend, I want to help out so that EVERYONE CAN GET THE BEST POSSIBLE PRICE.
You want to buy dips and find that you bought at the wrong time, that's on you. However, I will continue to read the tape and those who choose to understand and can see what I am saying is right, those are the folks I wish to help.
BUT I will not stop saying that one shouldn't buy right now just because you think there's a difference in physical coins and the futures market, or because of ETFs.
I wont stop telling you, that you are dead wrong to think that the futures market doesn't influence the price you pay for coins,,, wake up and smell the coffee, physical coin prices of gold and silver will always be beholden to the futures markets. The futures market calls that shots. period end of discussion.
and that's why I discuss the market movements in gold and silver, why I refer to GLD and SLV, they are easy for the folks at home to understand,follow and are good BENCHMARKS for determining where gold and silver go.
NOW, if anyone took offense or took it personally because I said bag holder, let me state I was not putting anyone down. I will offer a sincere apology if you thought I was putting you down. That was NOT my intention. IT was not personal.
I will continue to discuss the market movements in price in regards to gold and silver, because there is NO DISCONNECT between futures, ETFs or gold and silver coins. No amount of buying of silver and gold coins is going to boost prices if the futures market is NOT going higher. You will NEVER win that argument, and if you do want to argue about it, don't come to me, you can go argue with the market. Going forward I will ignore all comments disputing this.
more later
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Valued Member
Canada
470 Posts |
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Which is in no way shape or form proof that metals are manipulated like you claimed. ~ degenerate statement, - self denial and zero integrity. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3789 Posts |
BTW- with JUST a little know-how,, you could certainly hedge your physical coins with selling short ETFs, as an example. If someone asked me how to sell short, I would be more than glad to show, I once offered to do some postings on using various metal ETFs,,, but didnt get any feedback.
I dont understand why such push back for offering free help, I am not asking for anything. I mean, I AM your fellow coin collector who also happens to trader and is in the thick of this everyday. WE do have a common bond,, I dont think anyone has seen me say I DISLIKE gold or silver.... nor even silver or gold coins.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3789 Posts |
ANYWAYS, I wanted to make this quick observation-
Did everyone see how the rate cut by the ECB had almost zero effect in gold and silver? They continue to chop around, doing nada.
So, notice the reactions- Fed statement and zilch boost for gold and silver. ECB makes a rate cut and zilch, nada to make gold and silver move in a meaningful way.
Clearly, at this point, going forward, loose monetary policy, is not giving gold and silver the boost it needs if it is to go higher.
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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~ degenerate statement, - self denial and zero integrity. Is your point just to fear monger? |
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Replies: 5,643 / Views: 460,016 |
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Posted 05/02/2013 12:01 pm
