Small Motto Always With The Small Motto I Give Up

This coin is in my opinion just a regular 1864 large motto
I am seeing more and more claims of small motto varieties in the last few months I guess the series is becoming popular enough that the average person knows about the small motto variety and how much more expensive it is.

http://cgi.ebay.com/1864-2-Cent-Pie...RE_W0QQitemZ120172086364QQihZ002QQcategoryZ149924QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem



Sent this message don't know if it will do any good.

'This coin would not appear to meet the diagnostics for the small motto variety. The Base of the T should almost touch the we part of the Ribbon. The D in God should be wider and the gap between the top of the text and the ribbon should also be wider. There are other diagnostics such as the number of feathers on the Arrows. I may of be wrong but one or two years of collecting this series makes me fairly confident.
I would suggest you do more research and confirm that it is a small motto. I would hate for some one to be misled by your auction.'


Reply is not that encouraging the bid on the coin is already more than its worth.

'thank you, I am no expect however it is a close match to the coin shown in the link I provided in my description. I wish to thank you for you input an will look into in further before a final sale is made.'


After getting the same pictures posted in the auction e-mailed to me
telling me that the coin in the auction is a close match to the example shown I sent the following reply.

'Sorry mike I know you want it to be a small motto and if it were beleive me I would be bidding on it. It net grades F even with the damage and coloring which would make it around $275
Unfortunately its a large motto with a retail value about where the bid is at the moment.

You are reading too much into the motto on yours the o has been deformed by an impact in the past.
Lets put aside the motto for the time being. Lets look at the rest of the coin.
at the bottom right of the we on the ribbon there are a small cluster of leaves. On the large motto the leaves start at the corner of the ribbon.
With the small motto there is a stalk before the leaves your two pictures clearly show this. Your coin does not have the stalk.
The leaves on the small motto stay an even distance from the bottom of the ribbon (TRUST) the large motto they come closer to the ribbon as the progress. On your coin they come closer.
Now lets go back to the Motto itself.
there are two main indicators for small motto the T and the D
the D should be as wide as it is long and the hole in the D should be should be rounded. The large motto has a taller D so it will have more of s slit inside the D as yours does.
Next we go to the T on the small motto the top and bottom of the T almost touch the fold of the ribbon where the WE is for the small motto variety.
In the large motto variety there is a distinct gap as there is in your coin.
The distance from the top of the lettering to the edge of the ribbon is 1mm on the small motto.

This is as far as I go. You will have to decide for yourself.
About 1 in five of the coins listed on ebay as Small mottos are infact not. This is not due mainly to the fact there are very few people who know anything about this series of coins and they miss read what they see on their coins.
I hope you take some time and study this coin further.
If you have any questions about it here is a very good place to ask them.
http://www.coincommunity.com/forum/default.asp"

The reply I got

'Richard,

thank you very much for all your help. I will change the listing to reflect your suggestions.

Kind Regards,

mike'

He changed the auction for sure he now says he firmly believes his is a small motto variety. I only hope his reserve is high enough that no one will get stung. I know people should not bid on stuff they know nothing about but the seller has certain responsibilities also.