RCM / Royal Canadian Mint 'S Commemorative Silver Dollars Vs. US Mint's

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.

Author	Replies: 11 / Views: 1,980
commems CCF Master Historian of USA Commemoratives United States 12296 Posts	Posted 03/12/2015 9:10 pm The US Mint will be releasing its second (and final) commemorative silver dollar tomorrow. As I was looking at the usmint.gov web site for the details of the release, it occurred to me to compare it with the Canadian commemorative silver dollar. So, here goes. Specifications for the Canadian commemorative silver dollar: Composition: 0.999 fine silver Diameter: 36.07 mm Weight: 23.17 grams Actual Silver Weight: 23.17 grams Surcharge: $0 Selling Prices: - Proof: $59.95 CAD (~$47.20 USD) - Uncirculated: $54.95 CAD (~$43.27 USD) Specification for the US commemorative silver dollar: Composition: 0.900 silver / 0.100 copper Diameter: 38.1 mm Weight: 26.73 grams Actual Silver Weight: 24.057 grams Surcharge: $10 Selling Prices: - Proof: $51.95* USD (~$65.98 CAD) - Uncirculated: $48.95* USD (~$62.17 CAD) * These are the "Regular" prices; for the first 30 days after release, the coins are available for $5.00 less. A top-level comparison shows the Canadian dollars to be cheaper than their US counterparts, even though their mintage is much lower. A more detailed inspection, however, reverses that conclusion. A more fair comparison would be to look at the prices with the $10 surcharge removed from the US selling prices. (Note: In the US, the two commemorative programs authorized each year are intended to raise funds for their sponsor. This is accomplished by adding a surcharge to the selling price of each coin, with the surcharges collected being given to the sponsor; the US Mint does not keep the surcharge funds collected.) Selling Prices without Surcharge: [Hypothetical only] - Proof: $41.95 USD (~$53.28 CAD) - Uncirculated: $38.95 USD (~$49.47 CAD) Once that is done, the net selling price for the proof Canadian dollar is about $6.70 CAD higher; the net for the uncirculated dollar is about $5.50 CAD higher. Add in the fact that the US coin has 0.887 grams more silver, and the actual "value" difference widens a little more. A big reason for the net difference in selling price is no doubt tied to the fact that the mintages for the US coins are much higher than for the Canadian coins and manufacturing costs can be amortized over far more pieces. The maximum combined mintage for the proof and uncirculated Canadian Flag dollar is 35,000 (not including the colourized version in the proof set). The US dollar has a combined maximum mintage of 500,000 (though it's likely the final number sold will be much less.) All things considered, the prices for the coins of each country closely parallel each other - something not immediately evident by a simple comparison of their selling prices. Collecting history one coin or medal at a time! (c) commems. All rights reserved. Report this Post to the Staff

orfew Pillar of the Community Canada 1269 Posts	Posted 03/12/2015 9:34 pm Thanks Commems for the very interesting comparison. Report this Post to the Staff
dialog_gvf Pillar of the Community Canada 1581 Posts	Posted 03/12/2015 9:47 pm Quote: The US dollar has a combined maximum mintage of 500,000 For the first one (U.S. Marshals Service 225th Anniversary), the site shows 500K max for the BU and 500K max for the proof, and they are both out of stock! SD's are not bullion. So, ASW really shouldn't be a factor in the discussion. The key aspects driving numismatics are always: * Design * Scarcity The former is obviously very subjective. But, clearly the basic underpinning of the value is clear for the RCM product. But, that only is true if the SD is considered separate from all other offerings. It seems that the appeal to collectors for SD has fallen a huge amount for RCM product. Report this Post to the Staff
SilverDon Pillar of the Community Canada 2360 Posts	Posted 03/12/2015 10:41 pm The purity of 9999 in comparison to .900 is one aspect where RCM may have the advantage. The ability to resell the coin at a profit depends on the relative scarcity. Innovation and the use of colour has been a difference maker for the RCM. Looking at later releases with enamel and their popularity. Look at how ubiquitous the Goose Dollar is when you go to the LCS. A beautiful design is treated as bullion. They minted 67,000,000. Throughout the 70's it was one type of SD proof brilliant with mintages in the high 500,000 to 900,000, mintages have fallen dramatically since then in Canada, but quality has been enhanced as well. Our market is 1/10 the size of the US. Not sure about recent buying habits in terms of silver dollars as giftware. My sense is that is has dropped off - I used to get a SD for advancing a grade in school. I see the 2014 Baseball Hall of Fame Dollar going for $120 USD, that is one innovative bowl shaped design. Great comparison Commems. Edited by SilverDon 03/12/2015 10:51 pm Report this Post to the Staff
commems CCF Master Historian of USA Commemoratives United States 12296 Posts	Posted 03/13/2015 10:04 am Quote: For the first one (U.S. Marshals Service 225th Anniversary), the site shows 500K max for the BU and 500K max for the proof, and they are both out of stock! The 500,000 limit shown on each page is a "combined limit" for the proof and uncirculated coins, not the limit for the individual version. A maximum of 500,000 silver dollars can be struck across both versions. Quote: SD's are not bullion. So, ASW really shouldn't be a factor in the discussion. I generally agree, but included the ASW because for some of the Canadian issues of the 1970s and 1980s - and for some US issues from the 1980s - their price is often driven by their bullion value. It's sad, but it's true. Quote: It seems that the appeal to collectors for SD has fallen a huge amount for RCM product. Very true! Part of it has been driven by the extreme number of issues released by the RCM each year now - collectors have many more choices on which to spend there collecting budget vs. 20 or 30 years ago when the annual SD was the primary collector product issued by the RCM. Quote: Innovation and the use of colour has been a difference maker for the RCM. There is no doubt that it has created a broad range of RCM coins that can appeal to a large audience, many of whom are not necessarily hardcore collectors. I might be very wrong, but I'm of the opinion that all of the various innovations are eventually going to work against the long-term value of the coins. At some point, the race to create "new" coins takes on the feeling of gimmickry and I believe long-term collectors will become tired of all the variations. Just MHO of course! Collecting history one coin or medal at a time! (c) commems. All rights reserved. Report this Post to the Staff
McNickel Valued Member Canada 261 Posts	Posted 03/13/2015 3:36 pm Quote: At some point, the race to create "new" coins takes on the feeling of gimmickry and I believe long-term collectors will become tired of all the variations. Report this Post to the Staff
dialog_gvf Pillar of the Community Canada 1581 Posts	Posted 03/13/2015 4:09 pm Quote: I generally agree, but included the ASW because for some of the Canadian issues of the 1970s and 1980s - and for some US issues from the 1980s - their price is often driven by their bullion value. It's sad, but it's true. Yes, this is true. So many were made that ASW dominates their value. But, even then, the early ones are worth a LOT more than issue price. Even after inflation adjustment. But, the comparison was this year's coins. Basing comparisons of value based on ASW, means people are paying 4x spot for the Canadian SDs, which is nuts even compared to other RCM issues. Report this Post to the Staff
SilverDon Pillar of the Community Canada 2360 Posts	Posted 03/13/2015 5:34 pm Generally NCLT from the RCM goes for $100 ish per ounce + shipping. 5 x spot, so not altogether out of whack in terms of the Silver Dollar being a Proof Coin and with that you get a serialized COA and presentation case. So I think the modern day Silver Dollar has crossed over to NCLT fully. In the past it was currency, then 50% Silver commemoratives, then .925, now 9999 pure with colour and enamel and gold gilt. I am not certain that the gimmicks are good for the game and it may be like a race to the bottom, soon, holograms, glow in the dark. When it is a frosted silver coin like in the 80's and the Proof coins of today, I am satisfied with those and good designs are much more preferable to pixelated coloured flag (I understand it is different and collectable but I think the quality of the colouring is lacking) or gimmicks. Give me a good old fashioned Proof Silver Dollar that I can buy each year. Report this Post to the Staff
commems CCF Master Historian of USA Commemoratives United States 12296 Posts	Posted 03/13/2015 8:08 pm Quote: Give me a good old fashioned Proof Silver Dollar that I can buy each year. I agree, my preference is for a traditional, unadorned SD in proof and brilliant uncirculated. Collecting history one coin or medal at a time! (c) commems. All rights reserved. Report this Post to the Staff
dialog_gvf Pillar of the Community Canada 1581 Posts	Posted 03/14/2015 5:37 pm I stand corrected. Spot has fallen so much that the multiple is now 4x - 5x. That's crazy. With lowered costs of materials, they have passed on very little of it in prices. Pure greed. They should have taken the opportunity to encourage increased acquisition by lowering prices. Ratchet effect: You can be sure if the PM prices started to fly up again, the RCM would argue they had to raise prices because of that. Report this Post to the Staff
SilverDon Pillar of the Community Canada 2360 Posts	Posted 03/14/2015 6:20 pm They get you coming and going dialog_gvf. It's like gas pricing, with oil at $50 a barrel we should be paying $.75 a litre. But we don't get the breaks when the commodity goes down, but we get charged extra when it goes up. Gas price is higher now because of speculation of possible future labour disruption at US refineries. Right. Silver is low, as low as $20 per ounce. The Mint can and does charge quite the mark up but the Mint has a monopoly on Canadian Coins, they can charge what they want. You can always buy bullion at $20 per ounce, it is very affordable. Report this Post to the Staff
orfew Pillar of the Community Canada 1269 Posts	Posted 03/14/2015 6:35 pm I am trying to be very picky about which coins I buy. There is always a bit of hesitation for me between buying NCLT coins and buying silver bullion. I have a few of each and like them for what they are. However, it is difficult to sometimes justify spending 4-5X the price of silver for an NCLT coin when silver is so cheap. I love the moon masks for what they are, works of art on coins. I love my maple leafs for what they are, a store of silver bullion. As I said I go back and forward between the two, but it is hard to deny that bullion is especially alluring right now. Report this Post to the Staff
	Replies: 11 / Views: 1,980

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.

All Forums Category: Canadian Coins and Currency Forums Forum: Canadian Commemoratives and Non-Circulating Coinage (NCLT)

The First Dollar, your premier source for bullion and rare coins. See our bullion list on the site and the coin inventory on ebay.

Silver Gold Bull US is the United States leading bullion dealer. We deliver gold coins, gold bars, silver coins, silver bars and precious metals to your door. Order today!

View Last 100 Active Topics

Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us | Advertise Here | Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum

It took 0.37 seconds to rattle this change.

RCM's Commemorative Silver Dollars Vs. US Mint's