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Weird Libertad Transaction

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fayster's Avatar
United States
32 Posts
 Posted 04/09/2015  5:19 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add fayster to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I ordered 4 1-oz Silver Libertads from Mexican Coin Broker aka Lois and Don Bailey and Son Numismatic Services. 4 different years, trying to complete the series. They arrived today. 2 of them were in slabs, which surprised me because the coins in the photos were not slabbed. But the weird thing is the NGC slab that said 1999 Libertad (MS 67) actually held a 1997. I ordered the 1999 coin and I guess they just grabbed the slab.

I haven't contacted them yet and have no reason to think they won't fix the problem, but I just find it odd that a 1997 coin would be in a 1999 slab. Thoughts?

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jdmern's Avatar
United States
1949 Posts
 Posted 04/09/2015  5:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jdmern to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
TPGs make mistakes like this more than you would think- they call them 'mechanical errors' or labeling errors
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fayster's Avatar
United States
32 Posts
 Posted 04/09/2015  5:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fayster to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't typically buy slabbed coins so am not familiar with the grading. Does this even look like a MS 67?

Weird-Libertad-Transaction
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SilverStackerKid's Avatar
United States
6478 Posts
 Posted 04/10/2015  02:21 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SilverStackerKid to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think there is a market for error slabs.
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matttheriley's Avatar
United States
1512 Posts
 Posted 04/10/2015  04:11 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add matttheriley to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Considering the 99 is the lower mintage, I think you got ripped.
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SA4H's Avatar
United States
2764 Posts
 Posted 04/10/2015  04:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SA4H to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The coin in picture doesn't deserve a MS67 grade, considering all those black spots.
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Northerncoins's Avatar
Canada
2019 Posts
 Posted 04/10/2015  05:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Northerncoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The coin in picture doesn't deserve a MS67 grade, considering all those black spots.


That is one thing I noticed about some of my libertads , while they looked great when I first bought them, (2013) 5 oz, within a year 4 out of 5 of the 5 oz bu I had where showing these black dots with stains flowing out from the dots, another reason "not" to buy bullion slabbed coins. You just dont know what kind of "latent" damage will show up as the years pass. Proofs are bad enough , some grading companies , maybe all dont use gloves when they grade coins,I have seen the video showing this, they touch the edge of the coin with bare fingers, so at the very least you could have finger marks on the reeded edges showing up years later, plus have you ever handled say 100 coins a day without gloves and "not" mistakingly touch the rest of the coin? Doubtful.
Edited by Northerncoins
04/10/2015 05:15 am
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fayster's Avatar
United States
32 Posts
 Posted 04/11/2015  1:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fayster to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am mailing it back today. At my expense, which now that I think of it isn't right when it was their mistake for sending it. Guess I'll follow up on that.

Like I said, I don't typically purchase graded coins, but the thought that a coin could degrade in the slab is a new one. Yikes.
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Northerncoins's Avatar
Canada
2019 Posts
 Posted 04/11/2015  4:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Northerncoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
but the thought that a coin could degrade in the slab is a new one. Yikes.


Its more common then you think, especially with bullion, personally I wont not buy any slabbed bullion,
big waste of money, just do a few searches about it , lots of grief with buyers of slabbed bullion. The only winners are the grading companies and the sellers.
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3789 Posts
 Posted 04/11/2015  6:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yup7676 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Northern is exactly RIGHT..... bullion coins,,, buying them slabbed, the chances of spotting, milk spots, etc is very common.

After much research, buying... DO NOT BUY BULLION SLABBED COINS!

You do not a slabbed coin for bullion coins to extract premiums, the bullion coin will stand on its own.

its clear, the higher mintage bullion coin, the less it commands over spot... the less mintage bullion, the more it commands over spot.. simple. Slabbing it you, the collector assume the risk if the coin degrades while in YOUR possession.

skip the slabbing... if you want to flip or re-sell in the future, just get a double or two of that coin... WITHOUT slabbing it.
Edited by yup7676
04/11/2015 6:43 pm
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denco7's Avatar
United States
2543 Posts
 Posted 04/11/2015  10:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add denco7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Don't know what you guys are talking about? I have over sixty slabbed bullion coin, including on going ASE MS69 Brown label, Libertads, Philharmonic and Panda collections. As well as several other slabbed bullion coins. NONE have degraded in their slabs, except my 1oz Wolf from my Canadian Wildlife series, which developed the much talked about milk spots that had nothing to do with being slabbed.

Seems like a lot of generalized statements from people that don't even collect slabbed bullion.

To the OP, that slab would have made a great novelty item for your Libertad collection. Although I am sur you paid a premium for the date. No telling if the date was just mis printed, or the whole label was made for an entirely different coin that was both a 1999 and MS67. The spots aren't defects, they are small toning spots from spots of residue that somehow got on the coin. Graders are supposed grade coins by the condition of the surfaces, not any toning that is occuring. Though they cannot help considering eye appeal.

The 1999 and the 1997 are generally the same price, the mintage only differs by 5000. Post pictures when you receive the new coins. I love Libertads.
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3789 Posts
 Posted 04/12/2015  12:55 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yup7676 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I collect a wide range of slabbed world bullion coins and all of them have developed milk spots, spots and other defects that knock down the grade.

So tell me again,,, what was it you were talking about Denco? Do you deny the milk spots?
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macmercury's Avatar
United States
5830 Posts
 Posted 04/12/2015  01:35 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add macmercury to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Better check your storage condition Yup!
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3789 Posts
 Posted 04/12/2015  02:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yup7676 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It cant be storage because several of these were sold to me in this condition by MCM, Modern Coin Mart....
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fayster's Avatar
United States
32 Posts
 Posted 04/12/2015  3:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fayster to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Denco...if only I could justify the novelty of the mis-labeled slab. But the budget doesn't allow for that.

I asked the folks if they had any unslabbed 1999's and in what condition. They didn't answer so I don't think I'm going to be buying anymore from them. They are evidently on a very tight word budget because all of the answers I received were of 5 words or less.
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hu5kers77's Avatar
United States
88 Posts
 Posted 08/10/2015  2:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hu5kers77 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have submitted questions to 'Mexican Broker' in the past via their website and have never heard back. Hope this problem was rectified and their communication improved.
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