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Home Security System: Help

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FordF150's Avatar
United States
243 Posts
 Posted 01/11/2008  9:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add FordF150 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I keep my stuff out of sight too.I dont have either but I believe that window-door alarms and the metal sign might be a good idea
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 01/11/2008  9:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
mycrop: You never mentioned if you live in a house, condo, apartment, etc. Nor do you live in a large city, suburb of a large city or out in the sticks, so to speak. That is one of the first things for you to consider. If in an area where the police, fire, ambulances can't get there fast regardless of an alarm system, they are useless. For example note how many have used 911 and waited for a long, long time for a response. Home security systems can not do better than that unless they have their own police on standby. In some areas of Chicago, for example, the police really take their time for any calls due to their own safety.
Now think of this. Placing signs on your window, front of house, doors saying your protected by some agency is also adverising you have something worth taking. Not always real smart. If any criminal burst into your house with a gun, alarm or no alarm when someone gets there you usually will be dead. Professionals move fast and efficiently so that all is over long before any help gets there. See that add on TV for ADT? In real life that guy from ADT calling would be attempting to contact a dead person.
With our modern society of computerazation, everything you tell some agency you have is entered into a computer. This computer is full of your personal info and although the people working there today are reputable, if they loose their jobs, they could leave with all your personal info. Or as already been done people in those computer departments tell a friend of what you have and that person tells someone that tells someone. If you have a dollar, by the time it's retold over and over you now have millions at home.
Be carefull out there. The walls have ears and the windows have eyes.
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mycrob's Avatar
United States
2602 Posts
 Posted 01/11/2008  9:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mycrob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
How about security systems sold by Best Buy, Circuit City or similar electronics stores? Those systems have a camera or two (or more if you want to add on) feeding into a computer and you have ability to check from a remote computer via wireless connection.
Edited by mycrob
01/11/2008 9:56 pm
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FordF150's Avatar
United States
243 Posts
 Posted 01/11/2008  10:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add FordF150 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just carl.You've got some good points and maybe putting the sign in the yard would tell the would be robbers you have something to steal.We live out in the country "small farm" and when we were robbed the neighbor down the road said the guys that broke in our house waved at him as he drove by..Can you imagine that. I noticed that on the"Where are you from" topic most of the people told the state not the town...
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140 Posts
 Posted 01/11/2008  10:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MountainXBGL to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Let me say again.....Do not get the "wireless wonder" kits....They are trash. They work on a test bench under perfect conditions and look real flashy to please the "techno eye". If you are concerned about protecting your family and valuables, let a professional do his job.

Signs are not advertising that you have stuff to steal but are proven deterants...Statistically, your home is 333% less likely to be burglarized when you advertise that you have a security system. Think of it this way, if you are looking for a home to hit, are you going to hit the home that says its protected or the neighbor's home which has no visible signs of protection?

The biggest issue with units like the example given in an above post about the self-contained wonder unit that plugs into a wall outlet and sits on a counter....You walk in, snatch the unit out of the power and phone jack and the system is beat. If they enter the home through the entry/exit door and the unit never even made any attempt to alert you or the monitoring station before it was disabled.

Again, take my advice or leave it....I have more experience in this field than I care to detail but lets just say that I have installed systems that protected anything from a construction trailer to artifacts from the Museum of Natural History in NY. I know a little bit about security. Find you a local dealer who is not affiliated with a national chain, check their credentials like state low voltage licenses, UL listed monitoring and referrals from customers that have been with them for more than 2 years. You find that local guy who cares about his customer base, you will get a quality system, quality equipment, quality installation and quality service.....I can tell you some major stories about national chains that aren't too flattering. As a matter of fact, thats why years ago, I went into business for myself.
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coppercoins's Avatar
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7629 Posts
 Posted 01/11/2008  10:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coppercoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Heh...my home security system is to have so much dead weight in junk and worthless coins, a thief would never find the valuable ones, and wouldn't know what they were if they jumped out and bit them on the hand.

Actually, Brinks. And don't get window feelers, get the glass break sensors. Also, no need to have more than 1 or 2 motion detectors per floor. One per room is excessive. On mine, I like the fact that you can set the alarm for motion on or off, and you can set the alarm to go immediately instead of giving the 30 seconds to punch in the code. A thief can be half finished with their job in 30 seconds if they're good, and the monitoring wouldn't call until two minutes had passed unless they were really on their toes.
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mycrob's Avatar
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2602 Posts
 Posted 01/12/2008  10:03 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mycrob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Great points and information. Keep it coming!

One thing I just thought of is that if you have a camera system feeding to your computer, the computer would have to be well-hidden, because if that's stolen, you have no evidence- it's on the hard drive. The other thing is power outages- would have to reset the system with every power outage. Do any of them have battery backups in case of a brief power outage.
Valued Member
United States
140 Posts
 Posted 01/12/2008  3:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MountainXBGL to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The draw back to computer based camera systems(the ones where you buy a card, put it in your PC, connect a couple cameras) is you inherit all the PC problems that exist...for example....all windows glitches, faults..all compatibility issues(xp, vista, millenium)...your kid closes the program while searching the web....viruses....so on and so on.

If you are serious about camera security, you want a stand alone DVR(digital video recorder) that has an ample HD(250MB+) and power supply backup for both the DVR and cameras....I know...sounds expensive, well yes they are but they are not outlandishly expensive.

I just installed this week for a customer a system with a 500MB DVR, remote IP access, DVD burner for archiving, power supply, 6 cameras(5 interior dome and 1 external) for a total of $4000. She can log in and view archives or live feed from anywhere with net access. You can find Walmart or Radio shack setups for $400 and up but again, you are getting what you pay for.

Oh...one more point about security systems...most insurance companies offer a significant discount for monitored security systems with fire protection kickers that average around 20% less off your homeowners......In most cases, the 20% you save annually off your homeowners covers the yearly expense of monitoring and then some.
Bedrock of the Community
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20753 Posts
 Posted 01/14/2008  10:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Just carl.You've got some good points and maybe putting the sign in the yard would tell the would be robbers you have something to steal.We live out in the country "small farm" and when we were robbed the neighbor down the road said the guys that broke in our house waved at him as he drove by..Can you imagine that. I noticed that on the"Where are you from" topic most of the people told the state not the town...

People may not want to give out to much info here either. Are you aware of "people search" on the web. For free or a few dollars, with a minimum of info you can find out so much about someone it shocks the average person. They did that on TV not long ago. With only a name, state and town they were able to find the age, address, phone number, marital status, quantity of childred and their ages and lots, lots more. Then further with a search of the areas assessors offices they were able to find out the houses square footages, layouts, amount of rooms, attic, and lots, lots more. Now you can find out more about someone than they know about themselves.
So if a person in a coin forum constantly allows you to know what he has and you can find out his name and approximate location, usually through a PM, guess what is next.
So the crooks waved. Shows you they are friendly people, those crooks. One of my neighbors went on vacation. Moving van pulled up, enptied his house. Neighbors ask them what was going on. Movers said the people liked where they were at so much they decided to move there. Neighbors came back from vacation and no one could remember anything about the movers. OH, yeah. They had a home security system. Movers took that too. And they too were friendly.
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biokemist6's Avatar
United States
12437 Posts
 Posted 01/14/2008  1:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
most insurance companies offer a significant discount for monitored security systems with fire protection kickers that average around 20% less off your homeowners


IMO, that is the most important reason for having a monitored security system- not theft, but for fire. If you aren't home and your house catches fire, who is going to dial 911? The neighbor after your house is fully involved? I would rather have an alarm system with an autodialer that calls for help when the first smoke or fire alarm goes off. Those are the systems that will save big on homeowners insurance- a payout from theft would be dwarfed by any payout required for fire damage.
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FordF150's Avatar
United States
243 Posts
 Posted 01/14/2008  2:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add FordF150 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yea, I've used People search and White Pages.com to locate old Marine buddies that I had lost track of.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1231 Posts
 Posted 01/14/2008  7:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add onejinx to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I was talking with the local alarm guy today and got some info out of him

Home security systems are really that great. A cut of the incoming phone line at the box outside will disable the system from ringing the alarm company/fire/police. If you are going to use cameras, you need to hide the equipment that will be recording. Alot of the times the crooks will steal the VCR,DVR or computer that is doing the recording. Also the cameras would have to be set up on a pre-alarm system.

Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 01/14/2008  9:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Home security systems are really that great. A cut of the incoming phone line at the box outside will disable the system from ringing the alarm company/fire/police. If you are going to use cameras, you need to hide the equipment that will be recording. Alot of the times the crooks will steal the VCR,DVR or computer that is doing the recording. Also the cameras would have to be set up on a pre-alarm system.

Not only that but a hammer hit on the electric meter disables the entire house from electrical so VCR's, TV's, Monitors, etc. unless they are equipped with a UPS, they too will be useless. If the system is like a cellular, through the air type, those too can be jammed. A well educated criminal, and many are, can and do these things all the time. Example: One sort of friend of mine took many classes for auto repair and burglar alarm systems in cars. He over did the theft stuff a little so got caught but they do teach you how to disable alarm systems in places that teach you how to install them.
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jbuck's Avatar
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188130 Posts
 Posted 01/15/2008  11:11 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
No system is perfect, nor will it ever be. One can argue this ad infinitum. But you cannot escape the fact that the vast majority of crimes committed are on targets of opportunity. Criminals look for the quick score, the smash and grab, the door left open, the house with no lights or signs promoting a system, the running car in front of the corner shop, the laptop left in the front seat, the un-patched website, or the single tourist on darkened street. While all the alarms, guns, and preparation in the world will never make you completely safe, you are still statistically better off than the person that does nothing.
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mycrob's Avatar
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2602 Posts
 Posted 01/15/2008  1:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mycrob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I like statistics being in my favor, that's for sure. I had my house burglarized two years ago and lost about half of my coin collection, including the entire safe and all its contents (see my welcome page for more). We have a dog- that's step one. Now I'm trying to see about a security system. I have to agree with some of you that if you have a sign it should be a deterrent, not a "I have lots of goodies to steal" sign. For the average crook, I believe they would move on because their knowledge isn't likely to be high enough to know which system call the police, which ones don't etc. The ones that burglarized my house were below the average crook- left footprint on the door, and a fingerprint at the scene, leading to their conviction.

However, if you have a truly intelligent crook (which I think are few and far between), they will know about the systems, etc. Still they would have to know the contents of the house for it to be worth their while to take the high risk of going into a house with a security system. Without knowing what is inside the house (could be a button or doll collection for all they know), I'd have to think the intelligent crook would also prefer not to draw attention to the house that has a security system. I'll have to dig around for some statistics on this.
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