Survey Of Counterfeit Coins On Ebay

1805--Louisiana Purchase opens west--Napoleon on the March/naval blockade/attempt to influence economies and trade?

3pence - Welcome, you pose a VERY interesting question which is difficult to answer. Actually, I think that it is the answer that may be more difficult to hear.

There is an old adage attributed to Feldman that I love to repeat: "Buy the book before the coin."

That is the answer.

What he was referring to was the absolute need to KNOW for yourself. That is a difficult thing to do in some cases, but by reading everything on the topic that you can and keeping your eyes open you can actually avoid many fakes.

To try to give you a quick head start here are a few of the first things you need to do with reference to 8R coins.

1. Learn how your target coin was made. If you are offered a coin that was made differently - it is a fake.
a. An 8R with a reeded edge is FAKE. Period.
b. An 8R that is not silver is FAKE.
(1) Struck silver coins RING. Copper rings HIGHER.
(2) Real 8Rs are NOT magnetic - carry a refrigerator magnet.
c. Know which design was used in what year.
(1) Errors like the wrong assayer are often forgeries
(2) The wrong King is usually a forgery.
(3) Recut and overcut dies are often forged

2. Learn about counterfeit coins in general.
a. Transfer processes mean that the design will be RIGHT.
(1) Look for problems with the die surface.
(2) Look for FINE details
(3) Look for SHARP transitions letters to field
b. Look at examples of various types of forgeries

3. Trust your dealer.
a. A bargain is often fake. Beware CHEAP coins and great deals.
b. Know the correct price going into a deal.
c. Establish the return policy. Lifetime is best.

4. Not all forgeries are not REAL COINS
Watch for altered dates and mint marks.

That is a very BRIEF outline. Actually each comment above is worth a page or more of explanation.

Above all - be cautious.

Postscript: I just noticed the sale of a Modern Chinese counterfeit 8R on ebay for $74. Here is the auction link:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...280206255291

But just in case they pull the pictures here is the coin. Can you see what is wrong? Hint there are numerous answers but ONE that is absolute confirmation of the forgery.



Image Insert:

Thanks Bob! I appreciate your good advice. I guess everyone who buys on ebay or other online auctions is to some degree, buying a "pig-in-a-poke". You get to see the coin and they tell you something about it - but you have to trust their feed-back score and hope they are not doctoring up the photos.

As for the counterfeit Chinese 8 Reale you inserted: I am no expert at all so the only things I would say would be the tip off is that it looks perfectly round and the edges look more modern than colonial.

For anyone who has not seen this perfect looking coin, check it out. ebay item # 200204854478. A 1796 8 Real. dsclark11 wrote me and said: "The 1945 date is a mistake in my listing. I guarantee the coin is original and made in 1796 at the Potosi mint." I am not bidding on this coin but if anyone has any comments, I would be interested if you shared them. Have a great day!

I didn't have a reference picture of that exact coin, but noted that some of the other mints contemporaneously used I's for J's. Here's a link to the reference I use:

http://www.fuenterrebollo.com/faqs-...ca/menu.html

The pictures are in the link I posted above. On the left side there is a dropdown that goes through all Spanish coinage from medieval to modern. When you get to the later colonial period, especially Carlos III, Carlos IV and Fernando VII, it's a bit disorganized....still, after opening several pages, you will find listed just about every coin made at every mint in the Spanish empire. This includes pricing in pesetas (who knows when - I'm guessing late 90's - and who knows what grade), plus the photo illustration of at least one of the coins in the page's series.

I've also discussed the fuenterrebollo lists with Dan Sedwick, regarding cobs. A great deal has changed due to discovery of the Seville harbor wreck in the early 90's. Many of the ca 1660-1670 4R and 8R's which were scarce are now very common.

Now that I see what the J is supposed to look like, I can see that all of the ones I thought were I's are J's (1822PJ Potosi, 1825FJ Santiago, 1812JJ Mo). But some of the straight J's are more pronounced than others, and oftentimes the bases of the I's are split as well (see the example below - the bases of VII are split, which made me think the PJ on this coin looked like PI). Here's the one that has a J that looks most similar to the counterfeit's:



And now that I compare the photos, I can see that they aren't that close.

G'day SwamperBob,
please look at Item number: 300206510841
whaddyareckon, eh ? please ...
Peter in Oz

A few years ago I purchased a coin on ebay dated 1805. It is a Seated Liberty dollar. I now know they we not minted until 1836. Can anyone tell me if there is a way to dispose of the coin for its silver content only without passing on the deception? - Thanks