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Double Sided Contemnporary Counterfeit Eight Reales

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colonialjohn's Avatar
United States
1757 Posts
 Posted 08/30/2016  1:58 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add colonialjohn to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
A sandwich coin?

Simmons is one of the most respected dealers in England.

We shall see ... seen a few legitimate period issues in the contemporary halfpence series from England with NO edge imperfections of a sandwich. Around a dozen specimens exist according to some specialists (i.e., Palmer, Rock, Rose). In some cases however two coins were sandwiched and then smoothed over at the time of striking - by the counterfeiter (i.e., personally own two - one double obverse and one double reverse - i.e., both ex. Anton - Kessee). Its the smoothness of the rim under magnification. This is debatable but some experts agree on this notion that these are period pieces. These struck during the period sandwich coins are items to be viewed and then everyone has their opinion. Most agree of the period for the seasoned CC collector.

In this case on the edge there is no visible raised rim. Two counterfeit reverse dies according to this seller produced this coin. It should be known even before the popularity of counterfeit British & Irish halfpence Simmons was Mike Ringo's main supplier. For those familiar with the late collector Mike Ringo and his collection of CCs auctioned by Stacks in 2008 - the collection speaks for itself.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/22223464357...RK:MEBIDX:IT

We shall see ... from this highly respected source. With unscrupulous counterfeiters this sort of ANIMAL is possible. The main argument is how passable is such an item and this is a modern numismatic forgery since its promoting a rare type of error. Understood.
Edited by colonialjohn
08/30/2016 2:25 pm
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swamperbob's Avatar
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5362 Posts
 Posted 08/30/2016  3:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add swamperbob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The item is a button from the 1870-1880s period. It is not actually a counterfeit or forgery. There are numerous types that were used on military uniforms primarily. There are remains of a tang that has been filed off near the center of one side. The presentation of such a coin as anything other than a button is a simple fraud. I illustrated the type in my book on pages 175-177 with examples from the Richard August collection. In fact I had a picture of an example of the two obverse type.

Double-Sided-Contemnporary-Counterfeit-Eight-Reales

There are two reverse types as well (they are obviously undated) I have seen numerous examples.
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colonialjohn's Avatar
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1757 Posts
 Posted 08/31/2016  09:23 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add colonialjohn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes! I see it. Not sure to sell it or keep it? Yes a two sided reverse button. 19thC.

Will XRF it and probably post it on E-Bay at $9.99 to promote the book under this Class of later issued pieces.

No way Simmons was committing any fraud. Known him for 30 years and even visited his coin shop England when he had his coin store several blocks from the British Museum. We were both guilty of
not closely examining the piece <VVBG>.

JPL
Edited by colonialjohn
08/31/2016 09:25 am
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colonialjohn's Avatar
United States
1757 Posts
 Posted 09/07/2016  8:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add colonialjohn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Specimen arrived - properly cataloged. Posting to ebay tonight. Good luck. Low starting price. For a specialist that enjoys Class 4 Portrait buttons. See ebay seller: johnmenc.
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