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1909 VDB Wheat Cent For Grading

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United States
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 Posted 09/25/2017  6:20 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Crhnewbie to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hi everyone, what are your thoughts on this one?
1909-VDB-Wheat-Cent-For-Grading
1909-VDB-Wheat-Cent-For-Grading
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Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 09/25/2017  6:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Few ticks here and there, minor flecking, should be 64RD or better.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 09/25/2017  6:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thoughts?

1) Strong argument for 65. The marks in the obverse fields probably keep it from 66, but the reverse sure doesn't.

2) That comes with a caveat: The outside of the wheat leaves, in these images, look a little flattened. The images are a bit bright for their proper evaluation. This could be an artifact of the bright imaging lights, a bit of strike weakness, or genuine wear which would put the grade into AU. The obverse could be showing rub which the lighting washes out.

3) Speaking of the reverse, I'm worried about the spot under the M in AMERICA and the area of color around it. I don't know if that'd be a dealbreaker for a TPG or not.
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Coinfrog's Avatar
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 Posted 09/25/2017  6:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't think that would be an issue yet, maybe someday, but this is an old horse and I'm thinking that spot is stable by now. I still lean toward 64RD, with minor distractions but certainly no evidence of wear. Some strike weakness perhaps, but a coin with this color has surely never circulated.
Edited by Coinfrog
09/25/2017 6:40 pm
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477 Posts
 Posted 09/25/2017  6:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add throughtheireyes to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Beautiful Coin! MS65RD
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 09/25/2017  7:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
but a coin with this color has surely never circulated.


Trouble is, we don't know if the color is correct. There are no accurate references anywhere in the background from which to base a color correction opinion. With a background like this, you can do some pretty strange things to color without it giving you a hint that something's wrong....

1909-VDB-Wheat-Cent-For-Grading
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moxking's Avatar
United States
17900 Posts
 Posted 09/25/2017  8:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add moxking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The ever so slight toning locations primarily in the open fields argues for uncirculated. It's 95%+ red, so full red. Strict technical grade closer to 64 than 65.

I would, unfortunately, have to agree with Frog YET AGAIN.

...so annoying...
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T-BOP's Avatar
United States
18456 Posts
 Posted 09/25/2017  9:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add T-BOP to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
A real nice MS-64RD , few minor issues .
Edited by T-BOP
09/25/2017 9:01 pm
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Coinfrog's Avatar
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 Posted 09/25/2017  9:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Dave - Of course any manipulation is possible, but I have taken the original images at face value and see no reason not to.

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BadThad's Avatar
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19964 Posts
 Posted 09/25/2017  10:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BadThad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
A bit oversaturated - I'm having trouble reading the luster and fields. I have to go by what I can see with the given images. The distractions in the obverse field take away from the coin if they're really that prevalent. The obverse luster appears flat. Both of these could just be the lighting.

63-64RD

Suggest backing off the light some, using a white background (to show us the white balance) and cropping to just the coin. Your pictures are pretty decent, just a few tweaks and they could be very good. The goal is to make the picture replicate what you see in hand - easier said than done but you can get real close with practice. Listen to Dave, he knows his stuff!
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Joseph7420's Avatar
Canada
11922 Posts
 Posted 09/25/2017  10:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Joseph7420 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am thinking MS-64 RD from those pictures.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 09/25/2017  11:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Dave - Of course any manipulation is possible, but I have taken the original images at face value and see no reason not to.


I have no choice but to see reason to doubt, not because of any deliberate reworking on the part of the OP - of course not - but because this sort of oversaturation (as BadThad mentioned) is typical of imperfect White Balance correction.

In this case, I suspect the color is not far off - there's only a minor tinting in the background, which ought to be completely monochromatic - but experience tells me it could be, and I created the whimsical image above to illustrate just_how_far off the color could be without this specific background giving the inaccuracy away. It's why I constantly harp on monochromatic backgrounds, preferably white, from photographers who do not have expert control over White Balance yet.
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John1's Avatar
United States
56855 Posts
 Posted 09/26/2017  04:33 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I was thinking MS64 as well. But I don't like the mark on Lincoln's shoulder at 7K and the spot on the reverse,but I may be too picky.
John1
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