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John Paul Jones Comitia Amercana Medal

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 Posted 05/11/2018  6:38 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add dw171 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I bought this at an estate sale that had lots of medals/tokens and a few coins. I see there's lots of restrikes of this, but I don't know the subtle differences between them. It measures 56mm diameter and weighs 100 grams. Its very high relief and very detailed. No edge markings. Can anyone help put a date range to this?
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oriole's Avatar
Canada
5239 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2018  06:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add oriole to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's certainly a very attractive medal, whatever the vintage.
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
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 Posted 05/12/2018  10:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
It's certainly a very attractive medal, whatever the vintage.
I agree. I hope someone can provide more information.
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PatAR's Avatar
United States
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 Posted 05/24/2018  9:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add PatAR to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The medal is one of the Comitia Americana medals authorized by Congress to honor great Americans and events. This medal depicts John Paul Jones and his ship Bonhomme Richard at the Battle of Flamborough Head.

The famed medallist Augustin Dupre engraved this medal and the originals were struck in Paris some time after the famous battle. A limited number were struck in silver and bronze to fulfill the order of the US Mint Director.

So popular was the medal that restrikes were made at Paris to satisfy demand on several occasions between the original issue and circa 1880 and likely more at a later date. The U.S. Mint, by at least one account having tried and failed to obtain the dies from Paris, used one of the Paris medals to impress their own dies circa 1863. Examples struck from these U.S. made dies can be distinguished by the lack of the engraver's name. Circa 1950 the dies were delivered to the U.S. and were displayed at the US Naval Academy along with three gold medals struck from them. To the best of my knowledge none of the dies remained at Paris after that as the complete catalog of dies at Paris mint circa 1977 does not include the dies for this medal.

Medals struck at the Paris mint prior to 1798 and for a brief period in the 1820s and early 1830s have no mark on the edge. For other years Paris mint issues bear the mark of the mint director along with the metal in which they are struck. The marks unique to each director can be used to date the medals.

As your medal does have the engraver's name and certain other diagnostic features consistent with originals and you've indicated it has no edge marking of any kind it may well be either an original or early restrike. However, later restrikes from early dies cannot entirely be ruled out without further examination. If you're absolutely certain there is no hint of a small edge marking then I would recommend showing it to a medals expert at an upcoming coin show or perhaps submitting it to NGC for authentication.

I suspect you know this, but be careful to avoid wiping or otherwise disturbing the original surface.

Great find!
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
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 Posted 09/22/2018  2:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dw171 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
After submitting it to NGC, I still don't know any more about it. No date, just graded as a restrike.
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 Posted 09/23/2018  12:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
After submitting it to NGC, I still don't know any more about it. No date, just graded as a restrike.
Well, that is interesting to know.
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scopru's Avatar
United States
5029 Posts
 Posted 09/23/2018  5:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add scopru to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It is a beautiful item dw
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