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Ducale/Ducalis Roger II Palermo Sicily

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austrokiwi's Avatar
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 Posted 12/13/2018  08:44 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add austrokiwi to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Today I got received two items I have been hanging out for the first is the reference Medieval coinage vol 14. Getting that book means II can read up on the second item that arrived, the Ducalis. I had been hunting this coin off and on for about three years. It hasn't been high on my priorities so I probably missed out on a few opportunities. This is one coin( on my hunt list) I don't know that much about. The reason I wanted an example was that I understand this coin is the first "Ducat". I have some reading to do to find out about it but would welcome comments here. I will comment on the buying process.
In getting this coin I really was going blind, I had(have) no idea of its rarity and market value. I just know when I did look it was hard to find. I posted on a dealers page on Facebook a few weeks ago asking for indications of its value and the immediate responses were that it would cost in the vicinity of $1000, or a good part thereof. A week or so later another member of that group offered me an example for $1200.00. Before accepting the offer I did one further search, finally thinking like a hunter, and found an Auction house was selling one in San Marino. I don't buy often from San Marino as its a small state whose status in the EU customs Union can be problematic. I believe I had to pay duty on a previous purchase( but my memory could be wrong. I also, had another collector point out one had sold earlier this year for €600. I took a gamble and turned the $1200 offer down and bid on the one in San Marino. With postage and buyers premium I got this example for €380.00. I don't think the $1200.00 offer was off I just think there are so few sales of this coin that there is no firm market value. The other issue had was having in my search was actually what the coin was called. Some described it as a billon scyphate of Roger II. that's what I had usually searched for. I found this one searching for "Ducale" the Italian name for the coin. I am pleased with the example of have got although I think the $1200, which looked to be in the same condition when I compared photographs, might have been the better coin. I say that as although it looked good in the photographs when I photographed it I discovered there is a crack in the coin. the crack is hard to see by naked eye. You can see the crack more clearly in the hi-resolution image which is here( warning you can only view it by downloading the 168mb Tif file).
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1P...S9fvAuzLOtIG

Even with the crack, I am happy with the coin. It is from Palermo and struck between 1140 and 1154. It was issued by Roger II. I have attached a much lower resolution image to this post( you can spot the crack in the reduced image)
Ducale/Ducalis-Roger-II-Palermo-Sicily
Edited by austrokiwi
12/13/2018 2:43 pm
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echizento's Avatar
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23731 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2018  1:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am familiar with his bronze coins and have been bronze coins and have been looking for a nice Lion and Palm tree example. This however is the fist AR type that I've seen. Even with the crack and edge clips it's still a really nice coin . Congrats on finding this rare coin.
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Spence's Avatar
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34402 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2018  8:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Great pick-up @AK! I would attribute it as Biaggi #1770. By the way, the obv legend should be something like RR SLS -R DVX AP and the rev legend IC XC RG IN AETRN.
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 Posted 12/14/2018  01:23 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add austrokiwi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Normally I know the much more about the story of the coin before I purchase it. Last night I read ( devoured) the information provided in vol 14 of Medieval European Coinage.

What I already knew: Sicily in the 12th century was a very important trading nexus. Byzantium was still very much the economic centre of the Meditieranium would and the commercial revolution was only just starting in Northern Italy and was yet to have any marked effect, Sicily had been "settled" by the Arabs and then the Normans.

What I know now: Sicilies coinage ( under the Normans and up to 1140)was a PC amalgamation of Christian and Islamic design. Usually, one side of the coin would be, Latin and gently, Christian. The other side would be Arabic( Islamic leaning). Roger II appears to be quite an interesting character. Synthesising from what I read he seems to have been very capable both militarily and politically( as if there was a difference in the 12th century). He had one contender-Pope declare him King of Sicily in 1127. However, a rival Pope( Innocent II) ended up being recognised by Western Europe. Innocent II impulsively invaded Regno and ended up defeated and having to Ransom his own freedom. This saw Innocent II confirming Roger IIs Kingship. Roger II ended up dating his Kingship to 1130 ( the dating on the Ducalis).

IN 1140 Roger II Carried out a coinage reform. This introduced the coin (and a 1/3rd fraction) I purchased. What is notable about the coin is that it is a huge departure from the previous coinages. The coin is all Christian with Latin Script. It is clearly Byzantine. It is a billion coin( 60% silver) and Scyphate( cupped). From what I have understood so far the coin was designed for use within the Rogers Kingdom and Dukedom.

For me, the coin is now of much more import my collection, it's a "breakaway" issue that is European centric ( despite being Byzantine in form, weight and design) rather than Islamic trade focused. Roger II still produced the standard Islamic coins of Sicily, but this Coin shows the economic centre of mass was shifting to Italy and Western Europe.
Edited by austrokiwi
12/14/2018 01:40 am
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tdziemia's Avatar
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 Posted 12/14/2018  08:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Great commentary (I was eagerly waiting... )

Sicily was quite the polyglot place back then! I remembered the medieval coins sometimes had Islamic designs, and was aware of the Norman influence (they sure got around!).

I wounder if this is the "westernmost" manifestation of that Byzantine design? I use that term in the sense of Sicily being on the other side of the boot from Venice, and Roger being Norman as opposed to Italian, Hellenic, etc. (I realize that geographically Palermo is actually slightly east of Venice). Though I guess east/west/north/south was less relevant than the forces of economic/cultural change that you mention.

Great coin, great history!

Edited by tdziemia
12/14/2018 08:35 am
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