Three Numismatic Forgeries

In the pictures, they look quite 'pasty'.

Unfortunately these do sell - usually to novice buyers who have never seen an original before.

spruett001 You say


Of course the answer is Yes, they should.

The next question is - Will it do any good?

These coins should never be sold without the word COPY being stamped prominently on either face of the coin to comply with HPA regulations. Since this seller is actually selling multiple copies of these same illegal items and because he describes them as containing no silver, it is obvious that he is aware that he is selling worthless fakes. Under the letter of the law as amended, the seller is also engaged in simple fraud in commerce by supporting the distribution and sale of these illegal numismatic items. He is operating as an intermediary between the makers and the end market where an unsuspecting collector will be defrauded.

So in addition to stopping the auctions, the seller should be penalized for selling these items. ebay will no longer take any punitive steps in this direction and the authorities who could prosecute these cases simply will not do so.

So really the only thing we can do is to continue to point out these auctions and the names of the sellers so that the warning can be spread. These coins are so bad that no one should buy them ever. But they do sell.

This raises once again the subject of the HPA and what coins are actually covered and which are not.

Numismatic Forgeries of this nature along with other newly manufactured examples (in particular those that are far better made) are actually the only type of "fake" that should be reported to ebay for termination. These fakes violate the HPA because they were manufactured outside the US after 1973 and were therefore imported into the US without being stamped with the word COPY.

How do I know that? Because each of these three are slightly different from the earlier versions of coins bearing the same dates. These can all be identified as being made long after the year 2000.

Did anyone notice that the small o superscript above the M on the 1776 8R is almost missing? This is because the design is a newer version of an old standard. I have been saving copies of images of these NF types over the years and this variety is different.

The 1872 Peso also uses new die/mold images far different than those that were in production just a few years ago. Note the position of the small o between the two M's. It is just above 1/2 the height of the M's. It should be aligned at the top of the M'. Here is visual proof a coin sold new from China in 2012 - the last version.



If you compare this 2012 version with the new one being sold you will see it is a degraded issue with more deviations from the genuine issues than the preceding one.

Here is the Mint Mark and Assayer for comparison.
Literally NOTHING IS THE SAME:



These coins are still being produced in China where they are legal to create. They sell through whole sale dealers for a few cents to a few dollars each depending on how many are ordered. It is not illegal for the Chinese to sell these fakes, but it is illegal for them to be imported to the US.

fplagge I agree in general with your statement to avoid Chinese dealers on ebay. However, in this case the location given is Mount Vernon, Washington. So the dealer is ostensibly from the US.

I do not quite believe that. The wording of the description is poor enough for me to be suspicious of an off shore entity using a falsified US location.

@swamperbob

When I say "report," I mean in the CCF Counterfeit Forum. That, by far, makes more of a difference than an individual clicking the "Report" button on ebay. I would report them in the proper forum, but I don't have the expertise like you do to point out exactly what is wrong with these and why they should be removed. These should be removed and if you don't have access to the Counterfeit Forum, you know who to ask.